Car insurance- "totaled" vehicle- update post #28

[leebee]

If someone hits your car and is clearly at fault, can their insurance company declare your car totaled if the damages exceed the value of the car? I can see how if I am at fault in an accident, my insurance company can decide to not repair my car, but can the at-fault person's insurance declare the innocent, other person's car to be totaled? DD was hit by a guy who was trying to pass her on the left while she was turning left. The cops issued the guy two separate violations, there's no question as to fault, but there's enough front end damage to DD's 2005 PTCruiser to make me think that his insurance will declare it totaled. How are we supposed to afford a new (which means old, used, but new to us) car on what the insurance will give her? This really seems unfair, if this is the way it works. Anyone have any experience here and care to chime in?

 

[mel&me]

Yep, they will go by the blue book value, they are not going to spend more money to fix a car than the car is actually worth

 

[mel&me]

I will add that some times you can buy back a car for its salvage value if you chose to and really want the vehicle. A friend of mine did this when they totaled his 73 chevelle.
We did put it back together, but it will always have a salvage title afterwords.

 

[tvguy]

Yep, they will go by the blue book value, they are not going to spend more money to fix a car than the car is actually worth

Most insurance companies go by Actual Cash Value, which is lower than Blue Book or NADA.
It doesn't seem fair, because for many of us are cars are worth more to us than their actual cash value. But it isn't fair for the person at fault to pay you more than the car is worth.
And looking at KBB, top value selling to a private party for a 2005 PT Cruiser in Very Good condition is $2,500. Trade in Value is $1,000. That really underscores my point, I suspect that car is worth a whole lot more to you than that.

 

[disneychrista]

If someone hits your car and is clearly at fault, can their insurance company declare your car totaled if the damages exceed the value of the car? ... How are we supposed to afford a new (which means old, used, but new to us) car on what the insurance will give her?

Insurance is suppose to give you enough to replace her car. You do not have to accept their first offer. Have your daughter find the exact car she has now for sale. If insurance does not offer her enough to buy it, let them know.

 

[mnrose]

They will not give you more than the car is worth....why would they? That would be putting you in a BETTER position than your were before. So, you will get enough to replaced a 2005PT cruiser....not a 2016 PT cruiser, or even a 2007 PT cruiser.

You can certainly point out attributes of your car that make it "worth" more than what the average PT cruiser of that age is worth. For example, if you've owned the car since new, you can argue that it's worth more because it has a known repair record, you've cared for it in an above average way, etc.

If I were you, I'd start researching what it will cost you to replaced this car with a similar car. Get as many as you can find and present that information to the insurance company. Knowledge is power.

 

[Klayfish]

Yes, they can declare it a total loss. The damage doesn't have to exceed the value of the car, the insurance company can total the car at any point. Generally, 75-80% of value is the ballpark of a total loss, but I have totaled many cars at just 50% value. Hate to say it, but a 2005 PT Cruiser has limited value, so it probably is a total loss. They likely won't use KBB or NADA (though they can), they likely have a service the does valuations for them. That service is usually pretty accurate, but it's not perfect. Find cars comparable to yours (be realistic) and if that doesn't match, then show them the comparables.

What state are you in? Was there a dotted yellow line where this accident happened? Liability may not be as cut and dry as you think. The police don't decide liability, the insurance company does.

 

[The Mystery Machine]

If someone hits your car and is clearly at fault, can their insurance company declare your car totaled if the damages exceed the value of the car? I can see how if I am at fault in an accident, my insurance company can decide to not repair my car, but can the at-fault person's insurance declare the innocent, other person's car to be totaled? DD was hit by a guy who was trying to pass her on the left while she was turning left. The cops issued the guy two separate violations, there's no question as to fault, but there's enough front end damage to DD's 2005 PTCruiser to make me think that his insurance will declare it totaled. How are we supposed to afford a new (which means old, used, but new to us) car on what the insurance will give her? This really seems unfair, if this is the way it works. Anyone have any experience here and care to chime in?

Did the air bags deploy? If they did, they will total the car. If not, they may not total the car. A bent frame will also give you immediate 'total'.

Now it is time for you to develop THE HAGGLE. DO NOT accept a first offer unless it generous. You can haggle this till the cows come home. Is she driving a rental car now? That is the first thing you want. Obviously she needs transportation while her car is down.

If they decide to repair it and you accept the repair you are accepting their terms of ending the transaction between you, FYI.

If their offer is pittance, hire a lawyer.

 

[mnrose]

Did the air bags deploy? If they did, they will total the car. If not, they may not total the car. A bent frame will also give you immediate 'total'.

Now it is time for you to develop THE HAGGLE. DO NOT accept a first offer unless it generous. You can haggle this till the cows come home. Is she driving a rental car now? That is the first thing you want. Obviously she needs transportation while her car is down.

If they decide to repair it and you accept the repair you are accepting their terms of ending the transaction between you, FYI.

If their offer is pittance, hire a lawyer.

Hiring a lawyer in this kind of case is almost NEVER going to be worth it. It's a 2005 PT cruiser. It's absolute max value is probably no more than $3000-4000, and that's in "excellent" condition, which only a handful of cars are *really* in. Lawyers charge in two ways: by the hour ($150 would be a very conservative estimate) or 1/3 of what they get. I can't see how this is ever going to work in the favor of OP. Now, if there was significant injury to the daughter, it might be a different story. But, based on what OP wrote, it sounds like a pure property damage case.

 

[Klayfish]

Did the air bags deploy? If they did, they will total the car. If not, they may not total the car. A bent frame will also give you immediate 'total'.

Now it is time for you to develop THE HAGGLE. DO NOT accept a first offer unless it generous. You can haggle this till the cows come home. Is she driving a rental car now? That is the first thing you want. Obviously she needs transportation while her car is down.

If they decide to repair it and you accept the repair you are accepting their terms of ending the transaction between you, FYI.

If their offer is pittance, hire a lawyer.

Don't mean to be argumentative, but some of this isn't accurate.

Modern cars don't have "frames" and haven't for quite some time, but I know what you're trying to say. It's called a "unibody", and damage to it doesn't necessarily total the car. Given the lower value of OPs vehicle, that may be the case, but even that's not a certainty. Unibodies are repaired very often...even big trucks that still have frames (small and midsize SUVs are all unibody now too) get repaired.

If they decide to fix the car, you are in no way accepting their terms of ending the transaction. Not at all. OP picks the repair shop, then the shop is responsible for exposing all damages and the insurance company will pay for any necessary and related repairs.

You certainly can hire a lawyer, but it'd likely have to be a family friend who does you a favor, or someone you're willing to pay a lot of money to. Plaintiff attorneys won't touch a physical damage only claim, there's no money in it for them. You may be able to find a lawyer to take the case, but they'll charge you $1000 or more just to create a file for you, and you won't recoup that in settlement. Like I said, it's definitely an option and a right, but not likely and also not financially the best thing. I almost never see it, and really feel bad when I do.

 

[DonaldnDaisy5]

The car can be totaled. That is out of your hands and is bascially an algorithm, if you have someone in the autobody business that can search for and argue for the use of used parts for you and your estimate you might have a better chanc of not hitting the total mark. And damage is funny, I have a suburban that was almost totaled with what looked like just some minor front end damage because the frame was bent. Ended up putting a new frame on the car instead, worked for me it was finally paid off!

We also had a tahoe that did total. I fought with the insurance company on a settlement amounts for weeks. We finally argreed on a much more fair price than their first offer. Find comparable cars for sale. Did you just do repairs or put tires on? Those things go into account because if the car totals and goes to a junk yard someone will make money off those new tires.

 

[mnrose]

Most insurance companies go by Actual Cash Value, which is lower than Blue Book or NADA.
It doesn't seem fair, because for many of us are cars are worth more to us than their actual cash value. But it isn't fair for the person at fault to pay you more than the car is worth.
And looking at KBB, top value selling to a private party for a 2005 PT Cruiser in Very Good condition is $2,500. Trade in Value is $1,000. That really underscores my point, I suspect that car is worth a whole lot more to you than that.

It can be VERY hard to emotionally wrap your head around what a car's actual worth is. My 16 year old daughter got her license and we needed a car for her to drive. We wanted one that was reliable and in good working order, and decided to get that, we probably would have to spend around $5000. Well, we started looking around and quickly came to the realization that the car my husband was driving, a 2008 base model Prius which we had owned since it was brand new, was probably worth no more than that! LOL. Of course TO US, it was worth more than that because it had been babied beyond belief. But, to the rest of the world, nope. Sorry. LOL. So, we decided that rather than buy an unknown quantity for her to drive, we would give it to her to use. DH did get a "new" used car out of the deal, so it worked for him. And, we both feel much better with her driving a car that we know everything about. Plus, of course, it is far from a "sexy" car.....just a boring old Prius. And, it can't be driven like a race car.

 

[cvjw]

Sorry op, but yes the other person's insurance can total your car. Getting in an accident and not being at fault sucks. I am going thru it right now. You are basically at the mercy of the other persons insurance company unless you get your insurance company involved or hire an attorney.

I looked into hiring an attorney for my accident. It was not worth it. By the time you pay their fees and they take their cut, I would have been left owing money. I am dealing with the other persons insurance company myself.

Be looking for comparable cars for your dd. Be prepared for when you get your offer of what buying her the same car would cost right now for you. Also get records ready for new tires, etc. you can use those receipts to get your offer higher.

 

[bcla]

Sorry op, but yes the other person's insurance can total your car. Getting in an accident and not being at fault sucks. I am going thru it right now. You are basically at the mercy of the other persons insurance company unless you get your insurance company involved or hire an attorney.

I have never gone through another insurance company for auto damage, whether or not it was my fault. Most insurance companies will handle it, then they negotiate amongst themselves for who pays. I've even been told to not discuss the case with anyone but my own insurance company.

As for accepting an offer, I had my own insurer declare my car a loss. They had their own procedure for coming to a value, which was looking for multiple ads for similar vehicles and coming to an approximate average. They estimated the cost of repairs using new parts. I looked at the damage and thought what they offered was probably more than enough for repairs if I got mostly junkyard parts, but of course I had to turn over the keys. The adjuster recommended against trying to fix it, saying that in his experience there are always these little problems. I took the offer, especially since I'd bought another car and was considering selling this one anyways. I didn't just get the amount for the car, but a prorated refund on my insurance and registration fee. In the end I thought it was a pretty good deal, although how I got the deal was pretty traumatic.

 

[Darcy03231]

This happened to DS. Insurance company offered about $2000 less than what comparable cars were selling for. I went back and forth with the adjustor and she wouldn't budge. We took what they offered as a conditional settlement and sent a letter to our state's Dept. of Insurance outlining why we thought the car was worth more and with our comps. Lo and behold, once the Dept. of Insurance was involved the insurance company was able to come up with more money. We ended up settling out for more than what I originally asked for due to higher comps that became available.

 

[SMD]

If she's without a car you might want to go through your insurance and let them go after the other driver's insurance for reimbursement. You do run the risk of having to pay the difference if they're not able to get more out of the other insurance, but by that time you'd have a car for her to drive.

 

[Lilacs4Me]

We have been dealing with this for a year now. The other driver was 100% at fault - she was behind DH in heavy traffic going about 10mph when she decided to cut over into the (long) exit ramp lane leading to another freeway right in front of a car going about 45-50mph. He hit her, she ricocheted back into DH's lane, hit him, and then got hit again by the guy who was now behind DH. Her stupid decision caused a 4-car accident. Luckily, other than the guy going 45-50mph, nobody was seriously hurt. DH said that that guy got out of his car and seemed ok at first but said he had hit his head, then by the time the police showed up, he wasn't looking very good and said he was feeling sick. DH said his eyes looked glassy and dazed. They took him away to the hospital to check for a possible concussion. I hope he was ok....the highway patrol told DH that they see fatalities on that expressway all the time and that a car can be fixed so were lucky that nobody was seriously injured.

Anyway, there was no way the other ins company was going to pay out what the damage on our car was, plus the damage of the other cars - she only had a $20,000 policy. We talked to our own ins and they said they would handle it for us. We paid the deductible and they took it from there. It took 5 weeks to get out car back and nearly $10K in damage. We paid almost $200 OOP in rental car fees and used BIL's car for a while.

Finally, after 11 months, we JUST got a check in the mail last week for the rental car fees from the lady's insurance company. We also got a letter about 2 weeks ago saying they had settled on a payout, and our ins company would be sending us a check for our deductible shortly. I've pretty much written off the fact that we were ever going to see any reimbursement, but I have to say that we do have an awesome ins company. Had we just worked with the other lady's, we would have had to pay thousands to repair our car. I'm glad we went the route we did.

 

[longboard55]

My experience was full value as if you bought one on a lot plus taxes. I think you are better off totaling it then trying to fix it. Do not agree to anything till you are statisfied. throw in a couple thousand for injuries. If it is clearly the other guys fault they will be anxious to settle and will give you a good deal. If they give you a hard time, use the magic word. chiropractor

 

[Klayfish]

Hmm...what's magic about the word chiropractor? Or is it the threat of making a false injury claim to try to get money that you're alluding to?

 

[longboard55]

Hmm...what's magic about the word chiropractor? Or is it the threat of making a false injury claim to try to get money that you're alluding to?

Did I say make a false injury claim? Here is the deal, clean at fault accidents are pretty rare, and the party does need adequate insurance, which is often an issue. The insurance company knows you can take them to the cleaners, so accept nothing less that what you think is fair. You should not accept low blue book value in any conditions.