DCA’s Latest Gimmick

[airlarry!]

Chad,

This is a rumors board. We comment on rumors.

So yes, we are in Car #3 because the 'rumors' we are hearing about the IMHO unneccessary cut-backs on TOT and M:Space show clearly that management is just not learning from their mistakes.

Walt made mistakes. Walt corrected them and tried again.

Chad, I'm being serious here, for the purpose of our discussions, the rumors and AV's posts are showing a pattern of either negligence or utter disregard for the problems that WILL come about for future guests.

It sounds like you are suggesting that Car 3 people boycott Disney if we are so upset. Maybe that is a valid criticism, maybe not.

As for this topic, I would be incredulous if I thought you disagreed with this statement:

"The DCA summertime concert series, while a worthwhile edition to the fan who enjoys the bands, does not make me believe that Glendale understands the real reason for the current problems at DCA, nor do I believe that Management is demonstrating the ability and the plan to fix them."

As a dyed in the wool Car three'er, I agree with this above statement.

 

[Planogirl]

Is there anyone in Car #2 any more?

This Car #3 person is skipping WDW this year for the first time in a VERY long time. And yes, I finally decided to expand our horizons because of what I see as the state of WDW. I am adding Disneyland to our trip but only for a few days instead of the week normally spent at WDW. Plus we're staying offsite!

However I definitely wouldn't call this a boycot by any means. I'm just tired of the changes and I need a break. I still love Disney and expect to be back but I admit that I am rather excited about seeing new places. I'm considering Vegas next year and maybe even Europe if our money flow is good. Am I drifting away from WDW? I don't think so but frankly I'm not completely sure right now. I have to believe that Disney will get their act together, that they're just going through a transition. I HAVE to believe that they'll muddle through this situation just like before.

So there's some testimony from one Car #3 rider.

By the way, I notice that TBA and the Turtles will be at DCA while we're there. I have no problem with this but the Orange County Fair lineup does look better to me.

 

[Walt's Frozen Head]

I believe the legit debate, IMHO, is whether these bands meet add quality and value to a guests visit.

That is not a debate, that's a bunch of people making lists of what they like and don't like.

There is a difference between a popularity contest and a debate. There go those darned words, meaning things, again.

However, your "homer" characterization just seems like a fallback position for those who disagree with some of us who find magic in diffferent things.

Every one likes different things. I recall saying somewhere (can't remember where) that there is a difference between a popularity contest and a debate. Individuals enjoying different things is a reality that we have to work around in order to have meaningful conversations... enjoying different things is _not_ the reason people chose different cars.

You certainly have the right to your personal preferences, but a "legit" debate includes details beyond "me likey Test Track" and "me no likey Dino-Rama."

The things you like... what do they have in common, some thread that runs through the life cycle of the attractions, that could be used as a rule for designing the next one? "Design something Chad will like" is worthless in this context, because human beings are too different. No one can go in a room and design something that X percentage of people find attractive on demand.

If we find that thread, that similarity, that runs through the attractions most often liked by the audience as a whole, then we have something to go on; somewhere to start, when considering our next options.

If you like/don't like things based on Chad's emotional reaction to them, there's nothing there to grab onto; no starting point that suggests success for the next endeavor. It's perfectly fine for you base decisions on that, but "Chad's emotional reaction to" something is not any kind of valid criteria for decisions that occur outside your skull.

I personally think that the Soap Star weekends at Disney Studios is a bad, poor quality addition because it artificially crowds the park without adding something which has broad enough value to guests. Disney brand or not, this "something" is a bad move.

I understand what you say, here. Try this on: Cancelling EE is a bad, poor quality cutback because it artificially crowds the parks without adding something, period.

That doesn't sound like anything you've ever written about EE.

If someone tries to understand you by applying rationale you use for item A on item B, one finds that your argument doesn't seem to apply any longer. Your underlying reasons, motivations, and rationales change depending on which side you're arguing.

From a logical standpoint, your point of view is a car wreck.

From an emotional standpoint, your point of view is valid and honorable and just generally spiffy in all ways.

That's why I've got you pencilled in under "homer." Your arguments and rationalizations for "good" and "bad" business decisions are incongruent, and seem to be related to your personal preferences. In trying to make sense of that, I could choose between "he's a homer" and "he just want to argue about something."

If it makes you feel any better, I don't mean "homer" as an insult, I mean it as "someone who is so emotionally tied-up in Disney that logic takes a back seat in discussions concerning the topic." "Homer" was actually the less dismissive, more accomodating conclusion of the two I had to choose from.

Jeff

 

[raidermatt]

Scoop said:

I'll agree that these bands are NOT a fix and if management believes they are a fix then managment has NOT removed its head from the sand.

I don't think anyone disagrees with this, be they car 1, 2 or 3.

The problem seems to be that when we say that something is a nice, but small, add, we are labeled as mindless lemmings who can't see that this doesn't solve the big problem.

Yet nothing could be further from the truth. All I'm saying is that the bands will add value for some people. They aren't going to take value away for anybody. Therefore, its a good move. BUT ITS NOT GOING TO SOLVE DCA'S PROBLEMS! I (we) know this!

As Scoop stated, if this is the extent of mgmt's solution, its pathetic. If its just a small piece in a larger puzzle, or even a quick fix to bridge the gap until new attractions open, its fine.

Yes, DCA NEEDS some quality attractions. But that's not all it needs. It needs some atmosphere. And these types of live bands in a Paradise Pier location is a nice fit. Its not proof that mgmt understands the problem and is really fixing it, but on the other hand, its also not proof that they are not trying.

 

[DisneyKidds]

Here come those Vulcan mind tricks I was warned about .

 

[raidermatt]

If someone tries to understand you by applying rationale you use for item A on item B, one finds that your argument doesn't seem to apply any longer. Your underlying reasons, motivations, and rationales change depending on which side you're arguing.

Thank you for articulating what I have been hesitant to say about some of the car 3 riders!

You can see that EE is a takeaway, even if you don't use it. Yet you can't admit that bands, for example, are an add even if you won't listen to them, or consider them petrified. Talk about a logic car wreck!

I can only speak for myself, but I will say that YES, EE is a takeaway. All I'm saying is that it doesn't mean the place is going down the dumper. There have been adds, but when these are named, they are dumped all over by the car 3'ers who either think they don't add value for them, or consider them bad because of the perceived motivation.

I do want to add that I know I am generalizing, and I mean all of this in the interest of maintaining open, honest discussion with people whose opinions I respect, even if I don't always agree with them...

 

[raidermatt]

Here come those Vulcan mind tricks I was warned about

Ah yes, but I would classify them more as Jedi mind tricks, and they are quite common around here. However, remember that they only work on the weak minded...

 

[DisneyKidds]

Maybe we need a good Vulcan mind meld .

 

[daannzzz]

I am a car 2 1/2'er!!!! I am actually worried about the magic and have seen the latest projects assembled with only half the magic. I also see a change in the tastes of the persons in charge of making the decisions. I think the the company easily has the capability to return to what has been. Look at TDS. I am worried that they never will here in the U.S.!!!!
I too am not going to WDW this year!

 

[Walt's Frozen Kidney]

Quack, quack....

 

[Captain Crook]

OK, OK...I don't even want to think about hearing from some of Walt's other frozen parts...

 

[DVC-Landbaron]

JEFF!!!!

I've missed you!!!! I've all but worn my fingers to the bone at this keyboard!! Whew!! I know. I know. A tough job. But damn it!!! Someone's got to do it!!! (to be honest AV carried most of the load!!)

Anyway.....


W E L C O M E B A C K ! ! !

 

[manning]

You know what makes a great stew? A little bit of this, a little bit of that and a great cook. Have you watched people eat stew? Some will eat only peas, others only carrots and others all of it.

Walt was a great cook. He gave something for everyone.

I wouldn't want to go to an amusement park that had all E rides or all live entertainment. I want variety. That's what made Walt successful, variety. Before Disney Land, there was only one type of amusement park. All rides and dirty. Now, all we need is a great cook.

Boy has this post made me hungry.