Rider Switch changing (Started June 16th)

[Andyman33]

I have a too-small kid, she’s the 3rd so we’ve been through this for a while, and I personally have never felt that way. We make our choices, we alternate big and small rides, and we tour as a family. I don’t feel she is missing out in any way. She’s too short, she’ll get to ride the next ride. I’ve always found my kids did better with having that downtime during a RS ride anyways, rather than constantly rushing from ride to ride and from line to line. There are tons of other ways to enjoy Disney besides ride ride ride ride. And we like to do those small rides as a family anyways.

I hear it .And I hear YOUR style .but my style.is also not "crazy". In fact it's probably more common .My point was more that i can't see how it never crossed dthe pp's mind that was how many do it. We all want to play by the rules but the rules are always fluid and people use them to match their own touring styles

 

[DizneyMommy]

I hear it .And I hear YOUR style .but my style.is also not "crazy". In fact it's probably more common .My point was more that i can't see how it never crossed dthe pp's mind that was how many do it. We all want to play by the rules but the rules are always fluid and people use them to match their own touring styles

It is not about style. What you are doing is basically double dipping. If you decide to use your FP to go on a ride with your too-short child, then you should not be utilizing RS for the other ride. It’s not the intent of the RS program and it is unfair to other guests. Especially if you use it for 2 Tier 1 rides when someone without a too-short kid was only permitted to get one.

Disney clearly has not enforced it previously, but now they are going to with the new digital RS. I for one am glad they are tightening it down, for those of us who use it as intended

 

[Andyman33]

It is not about style. What you are doing is basically double dipping. If you decide to use your FP to go on a ride with your too-short child, then you should not be utilizing RS for the other ride. It’s not the intent of the RS program and it is unfair to other guests. Especially if you use it for 2 Tier 1 rides when someone without a too-short kid was only permitted to get one.

Disney clearly has not enforced it previously, but now they are going to with the new digital RS. I for one am glad they are tightening it down, for those of us who use it as intended

As.for.the "intent" of their program and reason for the change I have to agree to disagree .They aren't changing their strict policy because of this "double.dipping" as you say .they are changing it because people are using little.kids to get and then sell.fastpasses for avatar rides and the like on eBay .and as we all know only Disney gets to sell and make money on things that have no monetary value


Further I disagree with your intent of the program .My thought is the intent is more along my plan... ride with your kids on rides. Otherwise why have rider switch at all. If I have a fastpass for the ride then why get a rider swap at all I can just ride with my own fastpass by myself when they are done. There are many opinions on this hence why this thread is 30 pages long. No one is exactly right .but I am pretty sure I'm right as above on why it's changing

 

[DizneyMommy]

As.for.the "intent" of their program and reason for the change I have to agree to disagree .They aren't changing their strict policy because of this "double.dipping" as you say .they are changing it because people are using little.kids to get and then sell.fastpasses for avatar rides and the like on eBay .and as we all know only Disney gets to sell and make money on things that have no monetary value


Further I disagree with your intent of the program .My thought is the intent is more along my plan... ride with your kids on rides. Otherwise why have rider switch at all. If I have a fastpass for the ride then why get a rider swap at all I can just ride with my own fastpass by myself when they are done. There are many opinions on this hence why this thread is 30 pages long. No one is exactly right .but I am pretty sure I'm right as above on why it's changing

I would encourage you to email Disney and ask what the policy is. Email them a few times to make sure you get the same answer every time. I’m not making it up ;-)

 

[LongLiveRafiki]

It is not about style. What you are doing is basically double dipping. If you decide to use your FP to go on a ride with your too-short child, then you should not be utilizing RS for the other ride. It’s not the intent of the RS program and it is unfair to other guests. Especially if you use it for 2 Tier 1 rides when someone without a too-short kid was only permitted to get one.

Disney clearly has not enforced it previously, but now they are going to with the new digital RS. I for one am glad they are tightening it down, for those of us who use it as intended

I might agree with you more about the double dipping aspect IF RS gave immediate (or close to it) access to the ride. Since it doesn't and it takes a RS family TWICE as long to go through with FP as it does someone without RS, it's hard to see it as an unfair advantage. The RS family is spending twice as long for everyone to ride, while the non RS group can already be part or all the way through another ride.

With the exception of Soarin and TT, it's not really possible to get two Tier One rides with RS. Sure, it may have happened on other rides in rare cases, but that's not the norm or how it normally can work.

Do you think RS passes should be restricted to those who stayed back with the little one? Meaning, they can't bring 2 others with them. Those 2 others are getting an extra (oftentimes Tier One) ride, which is "more" than someone without RS can get. Given that THAT tier one extra ride can happen at all three of the parks with tiering (and is a well advertised practice) vs the tier bypassing with Soarin and TT which can only happen in one park (and isn't well advertised), I would assume that far more people are benefitting from extra tier one fastpasses due to the +2 for RS than by splitting the party for Tier Ones. How are the double riders not considered double dipping but the split party FPers are?

In regards to your second paragraph, again, we have no indication that they will be limiting RS to those with a FP.

 

[LongLiveRafiki]

I would encourage you to email Disney and ask what the policy is. Email them a few times to make sure you get the same answer every time. I’m not making it up ;-)

That is no guarantee of getting an accurate answer. Over the past two years, I've emailed them 11 times with questions about various policies. ONCE was I given a correct answer. Honestly, I've had better luck with phone CMs, which definitely isn't saying much.

 

[mom2rtk]

I see a lot of comparisons made with the new system at DLR. And I'm sure that's an important clue about how it will go at WDW. But the systems really aren't comparable. DLR has no tiers that people are trying to work around. And every FP for every single ride is available at rope drop every day. The motivation to find a loophole just isn't as high.

 

[ENJDisneyFan]

I see a lot of comparisons made with the new system at DLR. And I'm sure that's an important clue about how it will go at WDW. But the systems really aren't comparable. DLR has no tiers that people are trying to work around. And every FP for every single ride is available at rope drop every day. The motivation to find a loophole just isn't as high.

Great point.

 

[HopperFan]

As.for.the "intent" of their program and reason for the change I have to agree to disagree .They aren't changing their strict policy because of this "double.dipping" as you say .they are changing it because people are using little.kids to get and then sell.fastpasses for avatar rides and the like on eBay .and as we all know only Disney gets to sell and make money on things that have no monetary value


Further I disagree with your intent of the program .My thought is the intent is more along my plan... ride with your kids on rides. Otherwise why have rider switch at all. If I have a fastpass for the ride then why get a rider swap at all I can just ride with my own fastpass by myself when they are done. There are many opinions on this hence why this thread is 30 pages long. No one is exactly right .but I am pretty sure I'm right as above on why it's changing

And I disagree with you on both points.

Just like they didn't change the GAC to DAS due to the viral story of a rich woman hired a disabled tour guide to bypass the lines NOR the handful for sale on ebay. Hardly a drop in the bucket operationally. They changed it primarily due to ABUSE and OVERUSE by those who received the pass. The abuse came from those who truly didn't need it to manage their day but gave a story why they needed it, the overuse came from those who full qualified but didn't follow the intent which was to not use it as an instant FP+. This group is much smaller than the RS group but was determined with research it greatly impacted lines/operations. And part of that problem came from CM implementation. Disney is fully able to count and calculate how many are given, used, etc each day and the numbers rolled in they had a problem and it was impacting lines. I fully believe RS is abused and overused by guests and Disney, having paper passes could fully calculate this. It's more or less the same thing with variation ... and the RS is easier to get.

Second - the intent was not so you could ride multiple times and or everyone with each child. If that were the case many others should be able to get RS because they are split from their children when they ride. Key here = there was NO FAST PASS at all when this came in to play. They would do the swap either at the loading or having party 2 wait the exit then have to be escorted back in with a CM. Both impacted operations. I know because we participated in it. The INTENT was so a family didn't have to split up and wait in STANDBY line twice. It has nothing to do with making sure each parent got to ride with each child or some configuration of it. When Disney added FP they neglected to adjust this program which at the time wasn't as big an issue since you could only hold one FP at a time. But once the whole FP+ started, with 3 prebooked (and different members could book different rides), with tiers and hard to get rides ............ the RS should have been adjusted; in typical Disney fashion it wasn't. Then started the whole FP+ 101 here and on the internet of how to double, triple your FP+ and how to box in all the Tier 1. Add to that the other issues of selling FP+ and CMs handing out in bulk ......... we have a program that is being abused and overused by the guests and CMs.

You are correct that with FP+ technically the RS is not needed at all. BUT I think from a good business point of view it is good to (1) continue to assist those waiting their fair time in SB since Disney keeps the short child out of the line (2) protect those with FP+ from not having their window expire.

I see a lot of comparisons made with the new system at DLR. And I'm sure that's an important clue about how it will go at WDW. But the systems really aren't comparable. DLR has no tiers that people are trying to work around. And every FP for every single ride is available at rope drop every day. The motivation to find a loophole just isn't as high.

 

[DizneyMommy]

I see a lot of comparisons made with the new system at DLR. And I'm sure that's an important clue about how it will go at WDW. But the systems really aren't comparable. DLR has no tiers that people are trying to work around. And every FP for every single ride is available at rope drop every day. The motivation to find a loophole just isn't as high.

That’s kind of irrelevant. The new system sounds like it works exactly like the DL system. All parties get their ticket scanned, one hour window, can’t have 2 at a time. It’s exactly the same system. And it does a great job of closing those loopholes. Having tiers really doesn’t matter to the new system. You can only have one at a time and you have to be present to get scanned. Period. End to almost all of the possible abuse IF CM’s implement it consistently and correctly.

 

[DizneyMommy]

I might agree with you more about the double dipping aspect IF RS gave immediate (or close to it) access to the ride. Since it doesn't and it takes a RS family TWICE as long to go through with FP as it does someone without RS, it's hard to see it as an unfair advantage. The RS family is spending twice as long for everyone to ride, while the non RS group can already be part or all the way through another ride.

With the exception of Soarin and TT, it's not really possible to get two Tier One rides with RS. Sure, it may have happened on other rides in rare cases, but that's not the norm or how it normally can work.

Do you think RS passes should be restricted to those who stayed back with the little one? Meaning, they can't bring 2 others with them. Those 2 others are getting an extra (oftentimes Tier One) ride, which is "more" than someone without RS can get. Given that THAT tier one extra ride can happen at all three of the parks with tiering (and is a well advertised practice) vs the tier bypassing with Soarin and TT which can only happen in one park (and isn't well advertised), I would assume that far more people are benefitting from extra tier one fastpasses due to the +2 for RS than by splitting the party for Tier Ones. How are the double riders not considered double dipping but the split party FPers are?

In regards to your second paragraph, again, we have no indication that they will be limiting RS to those with a FP.

Well, I think it speaks volumes that none of the (reputable) blogs/guides that I have read have ever encouraged doing what you are suggesting, waiting parent gets a different FP instead of the same one everyone else has. YouTube “stars” maybe but I stay away from YouTube, nothing good happens there. If this was so widely accepted by Disney why wouldn’t all of the blogs and guides be encouraging this?

Second, you are affecting other guests experience by what you are doing. Is it a huge impact? Probably not. But it is not the way it is supposed to work. When you don’t pull a FP for ride #1, but you do pull one for ride #2 and then get a RS for ride #1, you are affecting the speed of the FP line in ride 1. The system did not account for you when it allocated FP to that time slot. If you had gotten a FP, it is basically just converted to RS. This is why I like the digital system, they can get a much better handle on the line throughout the day.

Now say a few dozen people do that in one time slot, and you start to see an affect on the FP line. Yes, the other returning guests also add to that, but not everyone brings someone back and Disney has specifically in writing said you may do that. Nowhere did they say Waiting parent does not need a FP and please feel free to go get another one for the same time frame.

 

[mom2rtk]

End to almost all of the possible abuse IF CM’s implement it consistently and correctly.

That's a pretty big "if" when it comes to Disney parks.

 

[OSUZorba]

@DizneyMommy does holding a RS pass at DLR keep you from getting a new FP also, or can you still get another FP after the CM scans your current FP?

 

[OSUZorba]

Well, I think it speaks volumes that none of the (reputable) blogs/guides that I have read have ever encouraged doing what you are suggesting, waiting parent gets a different FP instead of the same one everyone else has. YouTube “stars” maybe but I stay away from YouTube, nothing good happens there. If this was so widely accepted by Disney why wouldn’t all of the blogs and guides be encouraging this?

Second, you are affecting other guests experience by what you are doing. Is it a huge impact? Probably not. But it is not the way it is supposed to work. When you don’t pull a FP for ride #1, but you do pull one for ride #2 and then get a RS for ride #1, you are affecting the speed of the FP line in ride 1. The system did not account for you when it allocated FP to that time slot. If you had gotten a FP, it is basically just converted to RS. This is why I like the digital system, they can get a much better handle on the line throughout the day.

Now say a few dozen people do that in one time slot, and you start to see an affect on the FP line. Yes, the other returning guests also add to that, but not everyone brings someone back and Disney has specifically in writing said you may do that. Nowhere did they say Waiting parent does not need a FP and please feel free to go get another one for the same time frame.

When I was first researching RS I saw lots of places talking about doing Split FPs. Like I've said, I can see both sides of the argument and am okay with either side, but no one actually knows Disney's intent.

I personally always thought the intent was to allow you to ride something else with the shorty, because Disney wanted to be known as a great place for kids of all ages and sizes.

 

[JimmyBean42]

So having little ones that are too short to ride, I can completely understand both sides of the argument. How about this for a solution - what if for children too small too ride (but have a valid ticket), if they have a fast pass to something they are allowed 1 person to be a "companion / adult ride along". For example - family of 5 (DD, DW, DS (10), DD (8) and DD (3)). DD, DS, DW and DD (8) all have FP+ for Slinky Dog Coaster. Since DD3 is too small to ride, while DD, DS and DD(8) ride, DW gets her RS pass and then goes on TSMM with DD3 while the others ride Slinky Dog. Then DW goes on Slinky dog with DS and DD(8) w/ her RS, while DD waits with DD(3). I think this sounds fair bc on DW had a FP+ for Slinky Dog and only got the extra pass to ride with DD(3) on TSMM. This way DD(3) isn't sitting for almost an hour, she got to ride something as well, and it only account for 1 extra FP+ overall.

 

[DizneyMommy]

@DizneyMommy does holding a RS pass at DLR keep you from getting a new FP also, or can you still get another FP after the CM scans your current FP?

You can get another FP, not another RS. But the likelihood of getting a FP for a ride nearby the one you are waiting for RS, within your RS return window, is pretty unlikely. It would have to be an almost immediate return. DL mostly only has FP for rides which have a height limit anyways, there are only 2 rides in DL and 1 in CA that offer FP and aren’t height restricted. So we ride standby or we wait and find other ways to have fun.

 

[DizneyMommy]

Honestly, I think WDW should just get rid of the 3 FP prebooked and go back to one at a time while in the park like DL. I feel like it would eliminate SO much of the stress they are inflicting on guests that causes them to feel like they have to find ways to cheat the system. Level the playing field. Get a FP, ride, get another FP. I do not understand the necessity of booking them 2 months in advance at all.

 

[mom2rtk]

You can get another FP, not another RS. But the likelihood of getting a FP for a ride nearby the one you are waiting for RS, within your RS return window, is pretty unlikely. It would have to be an almost immediate return. DL mostly only has FP for rides which have a height limit anyways, there are only 2 rides in DL and 1 in CA that offer FP and aren’t height restricted. So we ride standby or we wait and find other ways to have fun.

And those standby lines at DLR move much faster than at WDW because they aren't feeding in and giving priority to FP returns.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Honestly, I think WDW should just get rid of the 3 FP prebooked and go back to one at a time while in the park like DL. I feel like it would eliminate SO much of the stress they are inflicting on guests that causes them to feel like they have to find ways to cheat the system. Level the playing field. Get a FP, ride, get another FP. I do not understand the necessity of booking them 2 months in advance at all.

I think it depends how you plan and vacation and how often you vacation.

I loooooove having my FP set ahead of time and not wondering which ones I would get day of, if I would even get a FP for a given attraction (back in the day, TSMM FP would be gone for the day within a few hours). I found the old way waaaaaay more stressful than the new way

I don't think it needs to be 2 months, but I love having them set ahead of time. I'd much rather stress before the trip - and then just feel much more relaxed during it

Though this might be part of why I found Disneland way more stressful than WDW

 

[DizneyMommy]

And those standby lines at DLR move much faster than at WDW because they aren't feeding in and giving priority to FP returns.

? I don’t understand. FP does feed in to the main line on most rides and take priority at DL, What do you mean?