Cruise and Theme Park Operational Updates due to Coronavirus

[Lewisc]

While I'm hesitant to draw many comparisons between the 9/11 aftermath and this situation, history does seem to be repeating itself within Resort Operations and Walt Disney Travel. They'll continue to try to maintain "price integrity" and hold the current price point while reducing inventory through resort closures and shuttering parts of "open" resorts until the efficacy of even that starts to wane (which, given where the pandemic is headed, seems to be already happening). Then, you'll start seeing the unusual discounts that will spark some demand (which, had they offered months earlier, would've likely been just as effective). People forget that the DDP (and Free Dining) was created several years after 9/11 as a way to fill rooms that they just weren't able to fill. It's fascinating to me how much they've learned over the last 20 years but also how little they've learned at the same time.

My memory is DDP was designed to fill empty restaurants.

After 9-11 people didn't feel safe traveling. Disney discovered discounts wouldn't be enough to motivate guests. Disney reduced inventory.

Covid is different. At least some guests aren't safe traveling. How many famlies travel with a grandparent? Some guests aren't allowed to enter the US. Don't international guests account for 15-20%. Convention business is dead.

Safety, loss of international guests and conventions. Discounts won't bring those groups back today.

Reducing inventory is necessary. Discounts don't make sense if they only serve to reduce price to guests are already planning to go

 

[Lewisc]

It really bothers me they took 2 weeks to meet about something they're going to approve (what I mean is the FDA announced a couple of weeks ago they are meeting on 12/10 to discuss approval)

oh, and..

Scientists need to review the raw data. Approval isn't just yes or no. What is the minimum age for kids to get vaccines. Are there groups that are so affected by side effects that warnings need to be supplied. Do some people need to skip the vaccine.

I don't know if approval could take less then a couple of weeks. Drug companies and politicians don't have the final say.

 

[osufeth24]

Scientists need to review the raw data. Approval isn't just yes or no. What is the minimum age for kids to get vaccines. Are there groups that are so affected by side effects that warnings need to be supplied. Do some people need to skip the vaccine.

I don't know if approval could take less then a couple of weeks. Drug companies and politicians don't have the final say.

They have been, this is just to take the vote to approve it, which will be very close to unanimously approved. FDA already knows they are going to approve it, it's not a secret

 

[mshanson3121]

My memory is DDP was designed to fill empty restaurants.

After 9-11 people didn't feel safe traveling. Disney discovered discounts wouldn't be enough to motivate guests. Disney reduced inventory.

Covid is different. At least some guests aren't safe traveling. How many famlies travel with a grandparent? Some guests aren't allowed to enter the US. Don't international guests account for 15-20%. Convention business is dead.

Safety, loss of international guests and conventions. Discounts won't bring those groups back today.

Reducing inventory is necessary. Discounts don't make sense if they only serve to reduce price to guests are already planning to go

Do you agree however that say in a year or so, when the vaccines are well under way, numbers drop, people start to feel safer travelling, but perhaps are still recovering financially we might see discounts?

 

[SmartyBacon]

.

 

[musika]

I'm interested to see what discounts drop in January. The last few years there's been a Canadian ticket discount which we've taken advantage of twice. It would be pretty tone deaf to release this year IMO with the border being closed to at least land travel.

I think discounts only work if there's a compelling reason for people to travel and right now those will only attract domestic business I would think for the most part. I know here in Canada at least there's still travel advisories against most if not all international travel.

 

[yulilin3]

I'd buy that if the week between Xmas and NYE wasn't wide open with availability (even as the parks start to fill up). By this time during a "normal" year, almost all of rooms on property would be sold out, but right now, you've got wide open available across their limited inventory. This is likely exacerbated by the fact that Disney is still insisting Guests pay NYE prices when NYE, for all intents and purposes, isn't really happening at WDW this year. That, to me, is a very bad signal.

And still 60% off being offered to CM, unheard of for Christmas and NYE, plenty of availability.
The comparison with life after 9/11 is accurate, maybe we'll even see the return of a year of a million dreams too

 

[emilymad]

I know Disney isn't actively encouraging crowds but the lack of discounts is going to be a problem at some point. The hotel discounts aren't really better than what they do most years. We have a resort only stay planned for February because we have DVC points to use. We aren't planning to buy tickets as the cost is ridiculous for such a reduced experience. If they were to offer a ticket special we would probably buy tickets but I very much doubt such a special will be available.

Disney is stuck in the chicken and the egg scenario. They don't want to have huge crowds so they aren't opening new attractions or fireworks, etc but without those things how can people justify the cost of a trip? I feel like at some point Disney is going to have to do something either in better discounts or bringing back more park experiences.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Yes, this seems to be a very big concern right now (and one that is only likely to grow after the New Year). Clearly, the discounts (which don't deviate *that* drastically from what they normally offer to FL Residents and APs) are not working.

People are talking about the EWP, but at this point, Disney could put on a whole nighttime show at the resorts on weeknights and not have to worry about distancing at all.

On that same note, I have to take 192 to 27 to get back home passing a lot of condos that are vacation homes, traffic has been kinda crazy the past couple of weeks, i wonder if many are coming but staying at these vacation homes over Disney

I really am wondering if there just isn't the *need* to stay on property like there used to be. With no EMH, no 60 day FP benefit, they don't take your bags for ME, etc.

And the off property places, especially like Air BnB type places, are having some really cheap rates now so why pay $150+ or whatever for a value resort when you can get a condo off property for $80?


Might be one reason they are starting the character RV and stuff like that to add more benefits to staying on property

 

[Farro]

Maybe they were waiting for vaccine news to start dropping bigger discounts? I can see Spring discounts coming with the news (all) people may start getting vaccinated in April.

Yes, I know it will take long to vaccinate everyone, but sometimes it's just the notion that people are starting to get vaccinated that will spur people to start traveling again. Vaccines haven't even started yet but people's moods are already a lot brighter, looking forward, etc.

Luckily I was booked a while ago for April/May and got a good discount, so I'm not super concerned about what we are paying (of course it's still tough right now due to loss of pay we had), but I looked at the Fall just in case and I agree, it's outrageous.

 

[sullivan.kscott]

Do you agree however that say in a year or so, when the vaccines are well under way, numbers drop, people start to feel safer travelling, but perhaps are still recovering financially we might see discounts?

I’ll take a stab at wild guessing. Perhaps Jan of 2022 we’ll see some significant discounts. This summer and the next holiday season will probably be a decent balance for Disney of people with pent up demand who’ve been on the sidelines. Maybe they continue with the “standard” discounts we’ve been seeing until then.

Also add in the natural intrigue of early 50th revelers, and the naturally busy holiday season, and WDW (and pray DLP and DLR) will be ok for that season.

Come slow late winter months next year, they’ll be ready to actively draw in vacationers again.

I do think some of the lack of meaningful discounts has more to do with TWDC not wanting to appear wantonly irresponsible while trying their best to surf the next few months out

 

[Sarahslay]

My memory is DDP was designed to fill empty restaurants.

After 9-11 people didn't feel safe traveling. Disney discovered discounts wouldn't be enough to motivate guests. Disney reduced inventory.

Covid is different. At least some guests aren't safe traveling. How many famlies travel with a grandparent? Some guests aren't allowed to enter the US. Don't international guests account for 15-20%. Convention business is dead.

Safety, loss of international guests and conventions. Discounts won't bring those groups back today.

Reducing inventory is necessary. Discounts don't make sense if they only serve to reduce price to guests are already planning to go

You would be surprised how many grandparents were in the parks over Thanksgiving, and even some elderly/older couples traveling alone. I think right now a lot of the business loss can be chalked up to internaltional travel and conventions, but there are still enough people willing to travel right now of all ages. We did meet a couple of the UK last week who had chartered a private jet to come over, obviously not possible for more people, but he said for his family it was only a bit more expensive to do that than fly commercial. I think if Disney wasn't concerned with keeping occupancy at a relatively safe number those parks would have been packed last week, at least on Thanksgiving day anyway. Going forward I don't even think Disney knows what it's doing, they're kinda having to fly by the seat of their pants, throw stuff at the wall and see what sticks for bringing guests back. I think park hopping, even in its modified form, will help, but really this is all so fluid and different it's impossible to speculate what Disneys biggest issue is and how to solve it.

 

[Lewisc]

Do you agree however that say in a year or so, when the vaccines are well under way, numbers drop, people start to feel safer travelling, but perhaps are still recovering financially we might see discounts?

Disney offer discounts, might increase prices 10% then offer a 15% discount. OK not that bad.

Discounts will attempt to motivate guest to vacation at WDW instead of other locations. Take a longer vacation.

Economic issues may still limit demand resulting in some resorts being closed, or partially closed

 

[MrsBooch]

Well hellooooo - we landed back home last night - I'm officially back to work today - work is lame and I would rather be in Disney.

I intended to post occasional updates that I noticed from the trip while on the trip but I ended up making an intentional decision to totally unplug from internet and emails and etc minus MDE and related activities.

I wanted to touch on a few points that had been discussed here as it relates to operational procedures and our actual experience. I'll be posting a full trip report at some point.

Before the trip I had read many times that hearing the health and safety messages blared over intercom about masks and distancing "took the magic out" of the experience - we did not find this to be true. Barely noticed it.

For the most part, mask compliance was excellent in the parks. I didn't notice people taking them off on rides? But sometimes it was hard to see and I wasn't actively looking. I also did hear CM's reminding people to pull them up - including kids. Which I appreciated.

Spacing in lines was the biggest issue as far as inconsistency and more words than actions. People just ignored the Please Stand Here markers and there was no CM to police that - which I don't know how they can unless someone is dedicated to stay in certain parts of the line.

Wait times were 99% overstated. I timed them because I couldn't believe the discrepancy between the touring plan estimates and the WDW listed times. The ONLY ride line time that was accurate was FOP. And my god you felt every single minute of that line. Average time we waited in lines was 30 minutes at any point in the day.

Food options from my perspective were perfectly fine, mobile order was extremely smooth we had no issues and I almost preferred it. The options were paired down significantly at the resorts.

From the perspective of an almost 6 year old, he didn't notice the lack of entertainment options. My son loved waving to the cavalcades but he is a ride kid, he just wanted to go go go so he didn't care or notice no parades or fireworks. I missed the EWP but hearing the news of the barges makes me so happy (and sad that I might have missed it by a few days/weeks).

Transportation wasn't an issue, Magical Express from the Airport to the Resort was fine - we had no line whatsoever and we were three of a total of 8 people on the whole bus and we were all spaced out and assigned seats. Magical Express from resort to airport wasn't assigned but people spaced out and no one was near us. We took the Skyliner without issue, and the boat from WL to MK, Bus from WL to DS and AK. No issues with spacing or feeling crowded. My only complaint is that I wish we had the resort to resort option on the table. It would have increased our food options. I get it, but that was something we all felt the absence of - we typically take the boat to Contemporary and then monorail around for foods and decoration viewing.

Holiday decorations were AMAZING. Wilderness lodge was breathtaking. I feel like they put MORE out than they normally do and that was across the board - at parks AND resorts.

The crowds were actually not bad for Thanksgiving week.
The only exception being Disney Springs. We went on a Monday and it was JAMMED. I felt uncomfortable while outside. We went to the LEGO store where capacity indoors was sufficiently managed, and we went to the Disney store (same with capacity indoors) but outside was kind of shocking.
Stores in the parks were being monitored for capacity (at least on Main Street) and in HS.

Things that were annoying related to COVID operational changes:
*elevators in the resorts (we didn't want to ride with anyone else and the rules were, either one party or no more than four people) but because of that - we had to wait sometimes four or five elevators worth before we could get to our room in the Riviera
*Please Stand Here in the lines appeared to be more of a suggestion according to the majority of guests we encountered (some parks were better than others)
*no resort to resort transportation coupled with minimal/reduced food offerings at resorts
*a lot of water fountains were disabled/not working. We use them to refill bottles so that was a bit of a stinker
*There were times where there was NO WHERE to sit or even stand with your food in Epcot.
*Photo pass - i read a lot about it before hand, I knew that things were different but this is the one thing where I really don't think there is any value in it right now. I know that we don't get pics if not everyone has their masks on, but we were on rides alone and still don't have pics. We were searching for photopass photographers in some parks without finding anyone. I will say that the BEST photographer we found was at the entrance of Galaxy's Edge - she did the special Magic Shot with The Child as well, she took her time and was awesome. However - it was for the most part a bust.

Things that were awesome despite COVID operational changes:
*the cavalcades
*the spacing in lines - when it worked and everyone paid attention - i love not having people trying to get piggy back rides on me while waiting in line.
*the interaction with CM's. I can't say that enough.
*the abundance of hand sanitizer stations - there were only THREE hand sanitizer machines out of 8 days of a stay 6 days in the parks, that did not work/ran out by the time we got there - i think these machines should stick around.
*Mobile Order - it was easy breezy but we also don't have food allergies or other issues
*7am Boarding Group drop for RotR - got it both times and I loved not having to yell at my family in the morning to get to the parks at a certain time and potentially not get a group

Overall - we felt that this was one of the best vacations we had in a long time. It was easy, it was fun, and it was still WDW. We enjoyed the resorts almost as much as we enjoyed the parks. We would go back again as it is now.

 

[DisneyPigFan]

They have been, this is just to take the vote to approve it, which will be very close to unanimously approved. FDA already knows they are going to approve it, it's not a secret

It seems like it'll definitely get authorized in the U.S. Not necessarily on Thursday, December 10th though. The meeting is not to take the vote, per se. It's to discuss it. They could authorize it that day, or that come come later -- few days or weeks even.

And I say authorized, because this is for an Emergency Use Authorization. It's not the same thing as FDA approval. That's a much stricter standard. They're more lenient for "emergencies."

 

[Sandiz08]

Just heard on our local radio that Disney emptied all the pennies/ coins in the fountains at Magic kingdom and pulled out 20k that was donated to the Homeless coalition in Florida .

 

[skeeter31]

Just a note on Parking. We had breakfast today at Trattoria al Forno at BW and once they confirmed we had an ADR were were allowed to park for as long as we wanted. With the hotel side of BW still closed, the parking lot was only 1/3 to 1/2 full. We ate breakfast, checked out BC and YC and then did our tour of the World Showcase.

Just a heads up, parking at a resort is supposed to be limited to dining at that resort and spending time at that resort only. It’s not supposed to be for people to have breakfast, wander to other resorts, and go to a park. But we all know that people do get around the system that way. But, you’re really not supposed to discuss ways of getting around Disney rules on DIS.

 

[rteetz]

Maybe they were waiting for vaccine news to start dropping bigger discounts? I can see Spring discounts coming with the news (all) people may start getting vaccinated in April.

They do discounts in waves. Right now most are through the March-April time frame. I believe the AP discounts extend into June. Overall these discounts by Disney standards aren’t bad. Unless they really have nobody coming I don’t expect them to get even better.

 

[mshanson3121]

Just heard on our local radio that Disney emptied all the pennies/ coins in the fountains at Magic kingdom and pulled out 20k that was donated to the Homeless coalition in Florida .

That's awesome

 

[tink2424]

Yes, this seems to be a very big concern right now (and one that is only likely to grow after the New Year). Clearly, the discounts (which don't deviate *that* drastically from what they normally offer to FL Residents and APs) are not working.

People are talking about the EWP, but at this point, Disney could put on a whole nighttime show at the resorts on weeknights and not have to worry about distancing at all.

Yeah, this is why when I went in September I stayed off site in a timeshare. There was ZERO value to staying on site. No magic hours, no FP window and incredibly high prices for hotel rooms. Disney is going to have to do something much better to entice more people to stay on-site. The perks are gone for now.