disabilities assistance Abuse

[SueM in MN]

In the U.K. we seem to largely minimise the risk of abuse by allowing organisations to request that anyone seeking assistance presents proof of registered disability. This usually also allows a carer to enter free of charge.

That would not work in the US because there is no system of ‘registered disability’; there is nothing to show a person is disabled.
Some people have advocated using a Handicapped Parking permit as proof of disability, but a couple problems with that:
- not everyone who would qualify for DAS qualifies for a parking permit
- not everyone who has a parking permit needs DAS; some just need the larger space in the handicapped parking spots or need a closer spot to the entrance to get out of traffic (those are the major reasons for handicapped parking, not to minimize walking)
- many people couldn’t use the parking permit for proof because they are using it to park

The last is there are legal limits in the ADA (Americans with Disabilities Act) in the US around asking for proof of disability as a condition of receiving accommodation for disability.

I agree. I had a really bad ankle injury (it left me with torn ligaments so poor stability and absent proprioception) and am fine everywhere except poorly lit damp steps like at splash. I just need to be able to see puddles or step edges and be confident where I’m putting my foot. Several years ago I asked if I could bypass the stairs at splash, the CMs told me I had to use the main line or get a DAS to circumvent the stairs. Guest services told me I didn’t need a DAS since it’s a mobility issue and to use an assist device. I don’t need a walker or a cane or a wheelchair: I just need to know where my foot is going and where the puddles are.

I just don’t ride splash mountain anymore and it is kind of cruddy that is the solution.

edited: for clarity

I think part of this was a misunderstanding or poorly stated by the CM

You were given bad information - you don't need a DAS to avoid the stairs, nor do you need to have an assistive device in order to avoid the stairs. The CM at Splash should have just let you avoid the stairs, as the DAS has nothing to do with that kind of need.

This is what the process is, and actually what the process was officially under the previous disability program.
For Splash in specific, the process is supposed to be waiting in the regular line UNTIL getting to the point of entering the building - that’s where the stairs are.
The majority of queues at WDW are MAINSTREAM Lines, which means they are accessible thru the ‘main’ line of ‘stream’ of entry. Some are Mainstream all the way to boarding and some have a ‘pull off’ that avoids stairs or other inaccessible points.
Disney Hollywood Studio and AK were built with all Mainstream Lines. EPCOT has one attraction without a Mainstream Line - Spaceship Earth.
MK is the oldest park and was has some that were not able to be renovated to make them Mainstream. There are only a couple with stairs; the majority of the inaccessible attractions at MK don’t have stairs; they need to get people with mobility devices to the unloading point to board because the regular boarding spot is on one side of the track and the unload point is on the other side.

 

[MS_Warrior]

I didn't think it was possible to get FOTL privileges just by renting an WC or ECV - generally you're not put in a separate line except for some rides (and then that line can be slower). You're not usually put into the FP line (or treated like you have a DAS). Other than, as someone mentioned, being allowed to board the bus first and bring along family, there's no gain by renting a wheelchair? Genuine question lol!

If the line doesn’t accommodate and ECV or WC, they’ll give you a return time. Then you go to a different area to wait, and you may end up waiting quite a bit longer than if you had been able to go through the line just because of logistics.

As someone who’s walked the parks and now does ECV/WC, there really is no advantage. I would trade with an able-bodied person in a heartbeat. We now do fewer rides, and my view of the park is everyone’s backside. I can’t look around as I walk because I have to be on constant alert for those who step in front of me.

It’s exhausting. However, I’m sure I was just as oblivious and stepped in front of people when I walked the parks. Not griping - just explaining that it’s a much more enjoyable trip if you can walk the parks and stay up with your family, etc.

 

[Gordo Gato]

Thanks for the info. Maybe I’ll try splash again in October. I assumed I was told I couldn’t avoid the stairs because they looked at me and made an assumption because I was in running shoes, running shorts, and probably had a race shirt on but they wouldn’t have known I only run on a treadmill or on dry, well maintained pavement. I just didn’t want to risk an even more catastrophic ankle injury by slipping on the stairs.
It was just embarrassing because I thought every assumed I was trying to game the system and I haven’t wanted to try again and create a scene.

 

[Lisa Garcia]

I have 2 children with Autism who both look normal. We have a parking permit just for the reasons mentioned above. We have wandering/elopement issues or if we are in the middle of a meltdown we need to get the the car asap. The whole reason we return to Disney year after year is for the DAS system. We would not be able to handle the parks without it. I do agree with the pre-register idea. Six Flags and Seaworld have this. Also, for Disney Cruises they have a specials needs department that really helps.

 

[valerie160]

The lack of fastpass right now is definitely driving more people to request a das as well. Obviously not right but I know at least two families who made up reasons to get a das since fastpass wasn’t available

This is so, so true. And so disgusting. My SIL (we both married into the same family) moved minutes from disney 2 years ago and a few weeks ago she kept mentioning her DAS pass. Of course I'm aware what a DAS pass is - and she knows this - because my son has down syndrome, so we've been using the DAS Pass for a few years due to his intellectual disability, sensory issues and mild physical disability and it's been very helpful for us. But I was totally confused why SHE would have a DAS Pass because I have known her and her family for over 20 years and I know they have no issues that would require a DAS Pass. When I questioned her, she said it helps her "PTSD" and quickly added that PTSD is a disability that DAS covers and Disney can't ask her for proof. My husband and I were flabbergasted, disgusted and livid, especially with her knowing our situation and blatantly abusing this pass for people that actually need it. I am 100% convinced she is using the DAS pass because FP isn't available anymore. Sadly, she is trying to be an "influencer" and has other "influencer" friends - I wouldn't be surprised if all these people are trying to find loopholes like this and doing the same thing so they can continue to enjoy FP+ type benefits.

 

[ZellyB]

Probably the worst is when people get a scooter or wheelchair just to get some type of advantage. Our last we actually came across a family that was arguing on who turn it was to ride in the wheelchair.

Our son has cerebral palsy and is in a wheelchair full time and the slight advantages that Disney used to provide helped a bit but there are so many things we can’t do.

While I understand your frustration with those who abuse the system, I really hope that you'd reconsider what I quoted above. First, I'm sorry that your son has to use a wheelchair full time and glad that Disney is able to help him and you enjoy the parks more fully. But your assumptions here are really upsetting to me.

I used an ECV for the first time on our last trip. I look just fine when seated, and not even too bad when I'm walking (especially early in the day). Less than 2 years ago my trip to Disney was to run a half-marathon. I thought I was the picture of health at 55 years old. Then I was diagnosed with metastatic breast cancer that has destroyed a few of my vertebrae and left me with numerous tumors throughout my bones. I had a rod placed in my right femur to avoid a pathologic fracture due to the bone necrosis caused by my tumors. I can walk, and do walk, in normal daily living. It's not possible at Disney as my mobility and stamina won't allow it. However, sitting full-time in a scooter also becomes uncomfortable and at times I would get up and walk and allow one of my teenage daughters to drive the scooter (perhaps you think I should have pushed it along rather than allowing them to ride it). At times, they argued over who got to drive it. Shocking! Obvious evidence of abuse!

I didn't use a DAS pass as my issues are primarily mobility and the scooter allowed me to use the regular line. Given that mobility issues alone do not warrant a DAS, I wonder why you think someone would bother to use a scooter to fake a disability since it's well-known that mobility issues alone do not warrant a DAS.

I'm likely overly sensitive to your remark as we overheard someone make a remark much like yours when we were sitting eating lunch one day with my scooter parked near by. It very nearly ruined the day for me and took all my power to keep my husband from going over and confronting the man. I wish I could tell you how many lines in which I'd stand; how many hours I'd be willing to wait; how many miles I'd be thrilled to walk to be rid of this diagnosis. I spend many days hoping I live to see my daughters and son get married. I honestly don't type all this out for sympathy or anything else, but hopefully to give you pause about the judgments you make based on appearance. I would think that you, having to deal with disability issues for your son, would be more understanding and compassionate about those things that you can't possibly know from a casual encounter at a theme park.

 

[MS_Warrior]

Thanks for the info. Maybe I’ll try splash again in October. I assumed I was told I couldn’t avoid the stairs because they looked at me and made an assumption because I was in running shoes, running shorts, and probably had a race shirt on but they wouldn’t have known I only run on a treadmill or on dry, well maintained pavement. I just didn’t want to risk an even more catastrophic ankle injury by slipping on the stairs.
It was just embarrassing because I thought every assumed I was trying to game the system and I haven’t wanted to try again and create a scene.

Quite a few years ago, when I could still walk the parks, but not do stairs, they refused to let me go on the train because I didn’t have a pass. Maybe their policy has changed since, but at that time I needed a pass (the precursor to the DAS) to avoid stairs.

 

[Groot]

I have 2 children with Autism who both look normal. We have a parking permit just for the reasons mentioned above. We have wandering/elopement issues or if we are in the middle of a meltdown we need to get the the car asap. The whole reason we return to Disney year after year is for the DAS system. We would not be able to handle the parks without it. I do agree with the pre-register idea. Six Flags and Seaworld have this. Also, for Disney Cruises they have a specials needs department that really helps.

Agreed. I wouldn’t mind if I had to state what disability I have. I’m used to having disclose it for other major things in my life (example for which I’m hoping to turn into a reality soon: Buying a Powerchair.) If anything, it would really cut down on the fraudsters and let us LEGITIMATE PEOPLE get the benefits we need from the DAS.

This is so, so true. And so disgusting. My SIL (we both married into the same family) moved minutes from disney 2 years ago and a few weeks ago she kept mentioning her DAS pass. Of course I'm aware what a DAS pass is - and she knows this - because my son has down syndrome, so we've been using the DAS Pass for a few years due to his intellectual disability, sensory issues and mild physical disability and it's been very helpful for us. But I was totally confused why SHE would have a DAS Pass because I have known her and her family for over 20 years and I know they have no issues that would require a DAS Pass. When I questioned her, she said it helps her "PTSD" and quickly added that PTSD is a disability that DAS covers and Disney can't ask her for proof. My husband and I were flabbergasted, disgusted and livid, especially with her knowing our situation and blatantly abusing this pass for people that actually need it. I am 100% convinced she is using the DAS pass because FP isn't available anymore. Sadly, she is trying to be an "influencer" and has other "influencer" friends - I wouldn't be surprised if all these people are trying to find loopholes like this and doing the same thing so they can continue to enjoy FP+ type benefits.

I hate influencers telling people to game the system like that that’s not even meant for them.

I think we’re on the verge of ScooterGate 2.0.

 

[MS_Warrior]

Agreed. I wouldn’t mind if I had to state what disability I have. I’m used to having disclose it for other major things in my life (example for which I’m hoping to turn into a reality soon: Buying a Powerchair.) If anything, it would really cut down on the fraudsters and let us LEGITIMATE PEOPLE get the benefits we need from the DAS.




I hate influencers telling people to game the system like that that’s not even meant for them.

I think we’re on the verge of ScooterGate 2.0.

It wouldn’t bother me in the least to have to state my disability.

 

[shawthorne44]

My grandparents took turns with the wheelchair. For the person pushing, it served as a walker.

There is abuse though. Didn't there used to be non-Disney run VIP tours that used someone with a DAS to get front-of-the-line passes? Like the tour guides kid?

A work buddy of mine with a DAS kid thinks the current system is more reasonable. He'd gone before when it was more generous.

 

[Makmak]

My grandparents took turns with the wheelchair. For the person pushing, it served as a walker.

There is abuse though. Didn't there used to be non-Disney run VIP tours that used someone with a DAS to get front-of-the-line passes? Like the tour guides kid?

A work buddy of mine with a DAS kid thinks the current system is more reasonable. He'd gone before when it was more generous.

A very long time ago, the entire group that was present with an individual in a wheelchair got front of the line access. In 1993ish I went with a friends family and the mother had a wheelchair (she didn’t normally, and I didn’t ask why she was in one that day but I suspect, knowing their scammer behavior, that it wasn’t needed ) and we got line cuts all day. There were people with certain disabilities that groups could “hire” to get line cuts. This was a big problem as they marketed themselves as tour guides but really you were hiring the disability status line cut. Since then ques we’re modified to allow mobility devices that solved the abuse issue.

 

[notatallmagic]

We are new-ish users of the DAS system. I think the issue now is that without FastPass, other riders are more aware of the system, and more upset by the seeming advantage (they likely don't understand that we wait just as long; just not in one place). Without DAS, we could no longer do Disney or any other amusement park, but my daughter looks "normal", so I'm sure people question our need.

One of our primary reasons to use DAS initially had to do with the newer Covid rules, and how they impacted our situation. We MIGHT be able to get by on most rides/lines with the old line rules, low crowd levels, and carefully crafted FastPasses...but maybe not. I think so many are frustrated because of the July overcrowding and waits.

Our most recent trip, my daughter had a life-threatening event caused by a failure of DAS to work the way it normally does/should - so it is necessary for us. She has also taken to wearing her medical devices proudly in plain view; I think maybe so that people can now "see" that she has a real reason to use "FastPass" line. Either way, I'm grateful.

 

[SueM in MN]

Agreed. I wouldn’t mind if I had to state what disability I have. I’m used to having disclose it for other major things in my life (example for which I’m hoping to turn into a reality soon: Buying a Powerchair.) If anything, it would really cut down on the fraudsters and let us LEGITIMATE PEOPLE get the benefits we need from the DAS.

I hate influencers telling people to game the system like that that’s not even meant for them.
I think we’re on the verge of ScooterGate 2.0.

It wouldn’t bother me in the least to have to state my disability.

Stating the disability would not do anything to cut down on abuse.
First of all, people willing to get DAS knowing they don’t have a disability are very likely to be willing to lie and say they have whatever disability they need to lie about to get it.
Second, people who have the very same condition/disability may have very different needs. Some people with cerebral palsy (which my DD has) can walk with little issue, some use a wheelchair (which they don’t need DAS to use in line), and some have additional needs that are not met by using a wheelchair (which they use DAS to meet).
Third, the ADA says you can be asked about your needs (which is why WDW Guest Relations CMs can ask what concerns the guest has with waiting in line).

Many people assume guests using scooters or wheelchairs get an advantage, but the only ‘advantage’ is having a place to sit in line while waiting. DAS specifically says it’s not needed for guests whose needs are met by using a wheelchair/ECV in line.

There have been abusers and influencers since the beginning. People were selling the old paper cards from the previous program (GAC = Guest Assistance Card) on eBay. I also saw blog posts from a pregnant influencer who wrote about getting a GAC by saying she was pregnant and couldn’t wait in line (at the same time, she wrote about traveling all over the word, including some pretty intense hikes).
Because there are no Fastpasses right now, there are probably more people without disabilities trying to use DAS, but I doubt it’s as huge a number as some people believe.

 

[MS_Warrior]

Stating the disability would not do anything to cut down on abuse.
First of all, people willing to get DAS knowing they don’t have a disability are very likely to be willing to lie and say they have whatever disability they need to lie about to get it.

This is true. Even requiring a letter from a physician won’t really cut down on it because there are always those who will say what you want them to. I think many times people see those who “look fine” and assume they are scamming.

However, it wouldn’t bother me to state my disability - I’ve had to with the TSA when they were insistent I could get out of my scooter and walk through scanner. Even then, it took me about 45 minutes to convince them I would fall. However, I do agree that it wouldn’t make a difference.

 

[Disneyfan754321]

I agree that people are abusing the system especially now that FP are gone... but it's a hard one because my ds has an invisible disability. He looks fine does not need a wheelchair. I try and remember that when I'm watching other people I run into getting return times.
Going back to when they changed the system because people were abusing it.
At six flags my son gets a guest Assistance pass.
I had to bring a doctors note it could not say the disability but had to have the words is unable to stand in line que. I know people still abuse the system but it seemed less.

 

[summerlyangel]

Anyone abusing the system should be shamed, but I really don't think it's a huge problem. I was there last week, and while I did see several people walk through the fast pass lines, it was not an overwhelming number by any means. When in those "fastpass" lines, we were usually part of a small number of people, and often saw the plaids there with their groups, as well. I was really surprised how many of those there were! In another instance, we got recovery fastpasses when RNR coaster went down at the end of the night and were able to use them at Soarin the next day in Epcot. I think there are quite a few of those given out, too. I do understand the worry, though. I think there will always be people that try to get over on the system and take advantage of what they perceive to be "extra benefits". I don't know how to prevent that without cutting off the system for those that really need it. Personally, I'd be ok with them asking for documentation, but Disney has decided that is not the way they want to go, for whatever reason. I'm also not sure why people argue about this, either when it's already required for things like getting a handicapped placard. If it helps with a need I have, I see it as a reasonable tradeoff.

For full disclosure, I asked for a DAS for the first time during that trip whereas I'd never needed it before with fastpasses. I tried to wait in hour long lines several times, but either had to leave the line or could not enjoy the ride when it was my turn because of the bathroom issues I have. After doing this for 4 days, I finally got a DAS for myself and was able to enjoy the rest of our trip. Again, this would not have been necessary had fastpasses still been available. We still often stood in lines for 30 minutes or less and saved the DAS for anything over that. For even more disclosure, we have used the DAS for several trips with my children that have autism, but never when it was just DH and I. With the kids, we've never been able to do more than 5 or 6 rides or experiences per day and certainly have never stayed a whole day in the parks! The DAS gives us the ability to experience some of what Disney has to offer, but I can guarantee that it will never be the same as what a typical family without these "hidden" disabilities is able to do on a regular day.

 

[Lilsia]

OP, are you basing this abuse numbers off of what you have seen? Because DAS users are not the only ones that use the FP lines now. People who have paid for the private tours use it, as well as Club 33 members. I have also heard that they are still giving out FP access to people who have had issues. So you really don't know who is going into the line an if they are using a DAS or not.

 

[HashberryOTG]

I do know there are people out there who make stuff up to get a DAS pass. However, the program definitely helps significantly more than it hurts. I also can't think of a single way to address the concerns of some people abusing it. We have little to no way of knowing which people ARE abusing it unless we're privy to information. Like hearing the woman I walk past bragging that she got a DAS pass to avoid lines not because her kids had actual issues of any kind, but because standing in line with them was annoying her. In no way from what I heard were those children terrors because of any disability. She was quite happy to brag about the opposite. Got to beat the system! There will never be any way for a company like Disney to know a person like that vs a parent of a child that truly needs assistance.

 

[Disneyfan754321]

Anyone abusing the system should be shamed, but I really don't think it's a huge problem. I was there last week, and while I did see several people walk through the fast pass lines, it was not an overwhelming number by any means. When in those "fastpass" lines, we were usually part of a small number of people, and often saw the plaids there with their groups, as well. I was really surprised how many of those there were! In another instance, we got recovery fastpasses when RNR coaster went down at the end of the night and were able to use them at Soarin the next day in Epcot. I think there are quite a few of those given out, too. I do understand the worry, though. I think there will always be people that try to get over on the system and take advantage of what they perceive to be "extra benefits". I don't know how to prevent that without cutting off the system for those that really need it. Personally, I'd be ok with them asking for documentation, but Disney has decided that is not the way they want to go, for whatever reason. I'm also not sure why people argue about this, either when it's already required for things like getting a handicapped placard. If it helps with a need I have, I see it as a reasonable tradeoff.

For full disclosure, I asked for a DAS for the first time during that trip whereas I'd never needed it before with fastpasses. I tried to wait in hour long lines several times, but either had to leave the line or could not enjoy the ride when it was my turn because of the bathroom issues I have. After doing this for 4 days, I finally got a DAS for myself and was able to enjoy the rest of our trip. Again, this would not have been necessary had fastpasses still been available. We still often stood in lines for 30 minutes or less and saved the DAS for anything over that. For even more disclosure, we have used the DAS for several trips with my children that have autism, but never when it was just DH and I. With the kids, we've never been able to do more than 5 or 6 rides or experiences per day and certainly have never stayed a whole day in the parks! The DAS gives us the ability to experience some of what Disney has to offer, but I can guarantee that it will never be the same as what a typical family without these "hidden" disabilities is able to do on a regular day.

It's so funny last time we were there , the line for DAS was super long. So I had to wait while my son waited inside in the air and when it was our turn people behind me got upset that i had to cut back in because I had to leave for a second to go get him.

These cheaters have no idea what we go through everyday and if we could give up the disability we would happily stand in every line.

 

[TwoMisfits]

In the U.K. we seem to largely minimise the risk of abuse by allowing organisations to request that anyone seeking assistance presents proof of registered disability. This usually also allows a carer to enter free of charge.

I would welcome this idea 100%. I don't even mind bringing the actual medical records, not just a doc's note.