If resorts closed, will DVC rental companies and Hotwire refund your money?

[Coffee66]

The DVC insurance through Disney (for owners) does NOT cover pandemics. Quite explicitly, in fact.

Ouch. Hope they do something

 

[Deb & Bill]

And the resorts and Disney Springs are shutting down. Resorts on Friday, Mar 20 and DS on Mar 17. Reopening? Who knows.

 

[John Kim]

I got a full refund from hotwire on a "hotrate" deal. That being said, I had to give them the number to Disney wholesale department that deals with 3rd party reservations in order to get it. Initially they called the main reservation line, could not get hold of anyone (welll duh- took my 3 days to get hold of a person at hotwire) and told me they couldn't. But once I gave them the number, it was done in 5 minutes. With hotwire, they will have to contact Disney to verify they will allow the calcellation.

Can you tell me what the wholesale departments number is? I have to call hotwire as well for a hotrate refund.
Thanks!

 

[foodiddiedoo]

I booked a trip to Aulani through David's Vacation rentals. It's for mid April. At this point I would go if the resort was open, but I doubt they will do anything for me if the resort closes. I just assume some lucky DVC owner is going to get my money and their points back.

 

[dreamit]

David’s has a statement on their site regarding their efforts to work with renters in situations affected by COVID-19.

 

[GoingSince1990]

If I had paid in advance for a room in a resort, and the resort was closed so I could not stay there, if anything less than a full refund was paid I would dispute the charge on my credit card.

 

[hereforthechurros]

If I had paid in advance for a room in a resort, and the resort was closed so I could not stay there, if anything less than a full refund was paid I would dispute the charge on my credit card.

It gets hairy because a lot of renters rent their expiring points. So you pay them, they spend their points. If they have to issue a refund it leaves them holding the bag to either quickly resell them again or in this case, eat the cost. Becomes sticky trying to figure out who should pay.

 

[nkereina]

This is all speculation on my part, but I would think if the brokers can mitigate by providing renters with alternative options (another resort on different dates), then any potential breach of contract becomes cloudier. I think this is why the brokers say they are "working" with renters - trying to reschedule them or perhaps offer a future credit. But I don't think a monetary refund would necessarily be due, legally. I've not read through their contract though.

Alternatively, its possible the brokers know which owners will be receiving their points back. Perhaps the brokers will be requesting money back from owners once their points are returned. The owners would be made whole at that point, so I would think there's potential legal concerns in them keeping any point rental money when their points are received back - owners would be coming out ahead in that scenario, rather than in the position they started in.

The brokers are exactly that - brokers between two consumers. Renting points is risky for a number of reasons, including this situation even though its an anomaly.

 

[lovethesun12]

I don't think most travel insurance cover pandemics like this. The DVC one doesn't mention it, so (someone correct me if I'm wrong) I have to assume it does not either.

That said, DVC is returning the points, so if I had rented points during this time, I would definitely return the money. The gray area here is that the resorts are remaining open, although time will tell how long that lasts. If a rented resort closes, the agreement requires a refund.

I rented DVC points for July. I am not expecting this trip to go ahead but I am also not really worried about the reservation. I wouldn't expect a full refund, but the members are human. They are not some evil scary monsters that don't want me to have a trip. Why wouldn't they make a phone call to try to reschedule? I'm sure they are worried about the potential outcomes just like anyone else.

I don't even care about DVC at this point. We are in the middle of a pandemic. If the absolute worst thing that happens is I'm out a couple thousand (which I will recoup by not going on the trip anyway) I'll be happy with that.

 

[Deb & Bill]

I rented DVC points for July. I am not expecting this trip to go ahead but I am also not really worried about the reservation. I wouldn't expect a full refund, but the members are human. They are not some evil scary monsters that don't want me to have a trip. Why wouldn't they make a phone call to try to reschedule? I'm sure they are worried about the potential outcomes just like anyone else.

I don't even care about DVC at this point. We are in the middle of a pandemic. If the absolute worst thing that happens is I'm out a couple thousand (which I will recoup by not going on the trip anyway) I'll be happy with that.

If you cancel or Disney doesn't open up by July, the owner of the points could have points that expire and cannot be used past that date. Disney isn't giving extensions to points that expire and are keeping banking deadlines according to the DVC rules for trips in April and beyond. To me, the brokers should refund all the money they have retained from the rental, plus the portion they keep for their expenses. And that is going to break a bunch of the brokers. Of course their business might be in the toilet anyway.

If the owner cannot reschedule the trip due to points expiring, they could keep the money they would have owed on their annual fees and refund the remainder. Most most owners use the money they get as soon as they get it; they don't pop it in the bank. So they will have to come up with the money to pay back a portion. On most rentals, the owner gets about $10 per point and they are owed about $4.00. The broker keeps about $4-5 per point for their fee. $8-9 per point from the broker and $3 a point from the owner might be better than a total loss to the renter. Except for last minute rentals which go for a lot less.

 

[bumbershoot]

Why wouldn't they make a phone call to try to reschedule?

I’m sure that many will.
But others won’t be able to. Points do expire. Reservations can’t always be made.

 

[dkpilati]

I am dealing with them now. DVC owners ARE getting their points back. David's DVC Rentals told me that they are asking owners "if" they will work with us and they are waving their staunch refund policy at this time. However, if the owner doesn't give the money back, then David's DVC says I am out the $5,600. I will never use them again - they have shut their phone lines down and mandate that you communicate through email. With them taking over 24 hours to respond and it is a different person responding each time - they really need to get their act together.

 

[Marionnette]

I rented DVC points for July. I am not expecting this trip to go ahead but I am also not really worried about the reservation. I wouldn't expect a full refund, but the members are human. They are not some evil scary monsters that don't want me to have a trip. Why wouldn't they make a phone call to try to reschedule? I'm sure they are worried about the potential outcomes just like anyone else.

I don't even care about DVC at this point. We are in the middle of a pandemic. If the absolute worst thing that happens is I'm out a couple thousand (which I will recoup by not going on the trip anyway) I'll be happy with that.

Making a phone call to reschedule your July trip isn’t going to happen right now. DVC Member Services is handling reservation affected by the March closure. If this extends into April, Member Services will give those reservations priority. July is far down on the list.

It’s possible that the owner booked your trip with points that expire at the end of July. And they could be past their banking deadline for their points. DVC is not extending the banking deadline for those points. At least not yet.

IOW, it may not be possible for your owner to “make a phone call”, be on hold for hours (yes, hours!) and only learn that it’s not possible to move those points into their next use year.

But let’s say that they can move those points. It’s not as if the remaining available villas will coincide with your preferred travel dates. Much of what is available are 1BR villas, which require more points than you rented for an equal number of days - pretty much double the number of points of a studio. The more popular resorts are already booked up completely.

If you booked directly with an owner, you should try to reach out to them to see if any no changes/no refunds policies will be waived by them. If you booked thru a broker, it will be up to them to contact the owner. All of the brokers are being slammed with panicked renters who have March and early April reservations. Your concern will not even be addressed by them right now.

I know that none of this will assuage your fears. But I hope this will give you a little insight as to what is going on from an owner’s end of things. Most owners will do their best to assist their renters. Just be aware that some things are beyond their control at the moment.

 

[Kuzcotopia1]

Has anyone been working with the DVC Rental Store? My trip is scheduled for May 10 - 16th so I have not reached out (other than to email my representative) because I know that she is busy with March and April vacations. I'm curious if anyone has information on how they have handled it so far for people with PPP (cancel any reason protection) and without PPP.

 

[Marionnette]

Has anyone been working with the DVC Rental Store? My trip is scheduled for May 10 - 16th so I have not reached out (other than to email my representative) because I know that she is busy with March and April vacations. I'm curious if anyone has information on how they have handled it so far for people with PPP (cancel any reason protection) and without PPP.

AFAIK, they have been refunding based on the criteria set forth in the PPP agreement. I believe that you get a certain percentage refunded based on how close to your arrival date hat you cancel.

 

[Kuzcotopia1]

AFAIK, they have been refunding based on the criteria set forth in the PPP agreement. I believe that you get a certain percentage refunded based on how close to your arrival date hat you cancel.

Technically, we are not canceling if our resort is not open. Although I'd understand pandemic not included blah, blah, blah. I am erring on pessimism at this point making that assumption. Boo!

 

[Marionnette]

I am dealing with them now. DVC owners ARE getting their points back. David's DVC Rentals told me that they are asking owners "if" they will work with us and they are waving their staunch refund policy at this time. However, if the owner doesn't give the money back, then David's DVC says I am out the $5,600. I will never use them again - they have shut their phone lines down and mandate that you communicate through email. With them taking over 24 hours to respond and it is a different person responding each time - they really need to get their act together.

With all due respect, “getting your points back” and actually being able to use those points are two different things. You knew when you made your agreement with David’s that there was a no refunds policy. The owner was assured, when they rented those points out, that they would get their money because of the no refunds policy. David’s withheld 30% of what the owner should get and they continue to hold it. They kept 24% of what you paid as their profit. So, out of every $1000 paid by a renter, David’s has $468 of the renter’s money. I understand your frustration. Owners are upset with David’s as well. They’re walking a fine line, trying to appease renters while satisfying the owners who are the life’s blood of their business.

Technically, we are not canceling if our resort is not open. Although I'd understand pandemic not included blah, blah, blah. I am erring on pessimism at this point making that assumption. Boo!

You asked what they are doing as far as their PPP is concerned. I gave you the answer. It might not be what you want to hear but that’s what it is.

 

[lanejudy]

Technically, we are not canceling if our resort is not open.

Technically, you are cancelling the contract. Your contract was for points. WDW is closing the resort. You have no direct business relationship with WDW for that resort reservation.

It's a lousy situation for all involved. Renter and owner and agent. Someone loses. It sounds like the PPP allows for shared loss.

 

[lovethesun12]

If you cancel or Disney doesn't open up by July, the owner of the points could have points that expire and cannot be used past that date. Disney isn't giving extensions to points that expire and are keeping banking deadlines according to the DVC rules for trips in April and beyond. To me, the brokers should refund all the money they have retained from the rental, plus the portion they keep for their expenses. And that is going to break a bunch of the brokers. Of course their business might be in the toilet anyway.

If the owner cannot reschedule the trip due to points expiring, they could keep the money they would have owed on their annual fees and refund the remainder. Most most owners use the money they get as soon as they get it; they don't pop it in the bank. So they will have to come up with the money to pay back a portion. On most rentals, the owner gets about $10 per point and they are owed about $4.00. The broker keeps about $4-5 per point for their fee. $8-9 per point from the broker and $3 a point from the owner might be better than a total loss to the renter. Except for last minute rentals which go for a lot less.

Making a phone call to reschedule your July trip isn’t going to happen right now. DVC Member Services is handling reservation affected by the March closure. If this extends into April, Member Services will give those reservations priority. July is far down on the list.

It’s possible that the owner booked your trip with points that expire at the end of July. And they could be past their banking deadline for their points. DVC is not extending the banking deadline for those points. At least not yet.

IOW, it may not be possible for your owner to “make a phone call”, be on hold for hours (yes, hours!) and only learn that it’s not possible to move those points into their next use year.

But let’s say that they can move those points. It’s not as if the remaining available villas will coincide with your preferred travel dates. Much of what is available are 1BR villas, which require more points than you rented for an equal number of days - pretty much double the number of points of a studio. The more popular resorts are already booked up completely.

If you booked directly with an owner, you should try to reach out to them to see if any no changes/no refunds policies will be waived by them. If you booked thru a broker, it will be up to them to contact the owner. All of the brokers are being slammed with panicked renters who have March and early April reservations. Your concern will not even be addressed by them right now.

I know that none of this will assuage your fears. But I hope this will give you a little insight as to what is going on from an owner’s end of things. Most owners will do their best to assist their renters. Just be aware that some things are beyond their control at the moment.

I recognize all that I'm just saying what is the point to panic? If they expire the day after my reservation they expire. I recognize they won't deal with me now which is why I haven't made contact - it's pointless. Hopefully this all blows over. If it isn't over by then the worst case scenario is I'm out vacation money.

I'm just saying there's no point to tear anyone apart or be mad because everyone wants a good outcome and everyone is at fault in a sense and has something to lose as well. The renter is nervous they won't get their accommodation (o.k. well you knew renting was risky going in). The member probably has only received 30-50% of the cost (also may be in breach of the contract). The rental company obviously has a ton of things to worry about (again, breach of contract, their business, etc). If the renter receives their points back and either uses them or re-rents then that is the very definition of double dipping which is illegal.

I'm not disagreeing with those looking at disputing the charge either. It's a valid argument. I just mean there are a bunch of possibilities that could lead to a decent outcome for everyone before it comes to that.

 

[ScubaCat]

Technically, you are cancelling the contract. Your contract was for points. WDW is closing the resort. You have no direct business relationship with WDW for that resort reservation.

It's a lousy situation for all involved. Renter and owner and agent. Someone loses. It sounds like the PPP allows for shared loss.

Not exactly. Quoting from the renter agreement on David's, "This is an agreement to rent points that represent accommodations only."

Points aren't just an entity on their own - they're an accounting representation of a fractional slice of time at a resort. Thus, per the agreement, a seller can't accept money (or not refund it) without being able to provide the accommodation.