Is it Eisner's Fault?

[yesdisneyfool]

Isn't it just mesmerizing how one standing on Main Street looking at the Castle and thinking of the Magic to come and Wonderful World of Disney.

 

[JeffJewell]

sometimes it takes some time for someone to show his true colors

I don't think it even took that long to see the true colors. It's just that a bit of one color can be a good thing, whereas a picture utilizing only one color is monotonous and uninspiring.

Eisner's strongest tools seem to be in areas like cost control, marketing, repurposing... the kind of tools you use to squeeze that last little bit of margin out of your product.

Walt left the company with a range of product that, while uneven from an individual enjoyment perspective, represented an unprecedented overall level of quality.

Miller and Walker failed to squeeze much out of the products they inherited, and failed to create new products that, overall, matched the level of quality of the dead guy's stuff. The company floundered.

Eisner and Wells came in, with Eisner succeeding in squeezing profit out of old products, while Wells made a damn good show of matching the dead guy in terms of the quality of new products. The company succeeded wildly.

With Wells gone, Disney became a one-trick pony. The new products were engineered with cost as the guiding principle, and quality went down; even though Eisner stills squeezes an appreciable amount out of the generations of product laying around.

So at this point, Disney has begun to build up a critical mass of newer products that fail to meet dead guy quality levels. Eisner is using the same tools that worked so well for him when he had quality dumped in his lap, but without anyone to ensure that quality is continuing to be created, the tools are applied to inferior raw materials. It's no wonder that the tools aren't producing the results they used to.

This gets to the heart of the reason I can't let go of the "bad ol' Imagineers" stuff. We've got years worth of Eisner's philosophy building up to the point that people are starting to notice it overshadowing the now decades-old quality products; we've got one data point where the Imagineers failed to make chicken salad out of chicken Shinola; and we've got the 'Scoop rushing in there to make sure the Imagineers take their fair share of grief for Disney's problems.

I suppose that all those moron worker-bees at Enron deserve their empty retirement accounts for their abyssmal performance, and poor Ken Lay deserves his billion dollar parachute for guiding the company as far as he did. Same principle.

Jeff

 

[DVC-Landbaron]

How do we know if he is showing his true colors, or if he has allowed "his" success go to his head?

Well, a valid point. But look at the things that happened early on in his career at Disney. I mean the things he insisted were done his way. Euro-Disney comes to mind. He didn’t understand the concept at all. And wasn’t there a movie that he was sure would be a hit and another that he was sure would crash and burn. The Rescuers Down Under and The Little Mermaid come to mind. And then there is the Floridian. A very, very, very nice hotel. But is it Disney? And don’t forget about the Institute!!

I’m sure AV can fill in even more. No. I think the Ei$ner we see now is the Ei$ner that’s always been there. He just doesn’t have any protection anymore.

On the other hand if you believe he never got it then the only solution is for him to go.

Yes!!! He’s got to go!!!

Scoop. I was never quite sure what was supposed to mean. Care to explain. Try English. I've heard that even lawyers understand that language!!

 

[hopemax]

I not only worry about Eisner "getting" Disney but just "getting" the products his company was trying to sell. I was at the shareholder's meeting in Seattle during the year go.com was the new thing. During the Q&A session he made a couple of derogatory comments about the Internet and its users. And a question about the internet from a 7 year old left him fumbling for answers. Not the best stance for a CEO to take to inspire confidence about entering the internet world.

 

[DVC-Landbaron]

But, the Imagineers involved in THIS project. Not ALL projects. Just THIS project. Did a horrible design job even on this bad theme. No consistency, no story about how PW fits into Chester's story. Heck, at least give us cardboard cutouts which at least try to tell a consistent story. Not just a bunch of lightbulbs hanging from strings.

Hmmmm. It seems to me they just gave Ei$ner what he was willing to pay for.

 

[mrtoadslastride]

Originally posted by DVC-Landbaron

I’m sure AV can fill in even more. No. I think the Ei$ner we see now is the Ei$ner that’s always been there. He just doesn’t have any protection anymore.Yes!!! He’s got to go!!!

Fair enough (as long as he takes Pressler et al with him). Who does Disney hire in his place? Is there any one left at Disney that can fill this roll, or do they need to go outside? Does Disney remain the company it is today, or should they jetison ABC ect?

I don't think the fix will be as simple as giving Eisner the heave ho. Most of the board probably needs to go along with the lion's share of upper management.

 

[DVC-Landbaron]

Fair enough (as long as he takes Pressler et al with him).

Of Course!! That goes without saying. But you’ve hit upon another key aspect as to why he has to go. Pre$$ler didn’t form out of a vacuum. He didn’t just materialize. NO!!!! Someone picked him to be in the position that he’s in! And Ei$ner gave tacit if not overt approval. So while those car #1 people deride Pre$$ler, they ignore that he’s simply the henchman carrying out his orders!

As to who? Almost anyone!!! My resume is ready!!

I don't think the fix will be as simple as giving Eisner the heave ho. Most of the board probably needs to go along with the lion's share of upper management.

Again it goes without saying!!

 

[Peter Pirate]

Was poor DisDuck besmearched?

 

[DVC-Landbaron]

Simply saying that if Eisner screws up (like he did) and approves a lousy budget, then Imagineering is off the hook for whatever the result is short-sighted.

Chad, I understand. But I don’t think you’re looking at the big picture. One of “what will the boss like that will keep us employed until at least next payday?” Something under budget. Bright. Cartoonish almost. Decorated, not necessarily themed. Large icons.

In other words – Ei$nerized!! And that’s what he got!! Something that the remaining few in Imagineering knew he’d like!! And I’ll bet he does. Cause he just doesn’t ‘Get It’!!!! Something that you and I, even at opposite ends of the poles, take for granted, he can’t even come close to understanding.

Yes, Eisner hired him. That was his mistake. But Plushler is accountable for his own actions.

What kind of a company do you work for!?!?! Accountable for his actions!?!?!? Absolutely not!!! He is accountable to Ei$ner!!! He could fire the guy any time he chooses. But he doesn’t. Why? Because he likes what he’s doing!!!!!

But, please, it's comical to give Plushler a pass because Eisner hired him. Ugh!

I’m not giving him a pass!! He’s horrible!! He’s awful!! Everyone should hate what he’s doing to Disney. But it’s Ei$ner’s fault!! If he doesn’t agree with his policies –THEN FIRE HIM!!!!

Geez, Jeff, your hatred of Eisner has created tunnel vision which in turn is missing the fact that other adults within Disney are also making bad decisions while some are making good ones.

And your love for him clouds your reason! Now get this – IF THE CEO DOESN’T LIKE WHAT HIS PEOPLE ARE DOING HE GETS RID OF THEM!!!! It’s really that simple! Those other adults making bad decisions should have been fired long ago. Unless, of course, the top cheese likes what they are doing.

 

[hopemax]

I've actually be thinking about Scoop's story problem with Primeval Whirl, and I've seen a couple of seminars given to the NFFC where the Imagineers in charge explainin how they got the idea for their project, and I've heard about a few more via my Dad, so may I present the following...

The question posed by the court is "What the heck does a wacky time machine have to do with a roadside carnival?"

So let's look at the land...we have Dinoland which is supposed to be an "actual" Dinosaur dig site. The centerpiece attraction is a "visit to the Dino Institute where, thanks to modern technology they can transport you via a TIME MACHINE back to the age of the Dinosaurs."

Then there is the Chester & Hester stuff which fits because: wherever you find a major attraction, tacky tourist stuff pops up around it." Well, what kind of tacky, tourist stuff pops up? Souvenir stands and what?

How about cheap knock-off's of the main draw? So what's the main draw of this area... Dino Institute and its TIME MACHINE!!!!

The Imagineers rest their case, and I hope to Walt I have not convinced the Scoop why PW is an excellently themed attraction.

 

[hopemax]

Every pleading I file is not reviewed by the top lawyer here. So, if I screw it up, then I take the blame. Oh sure, in some kind of esoterical way the top partner is at fault for allowing an associate to file a bad pleading.

But, that bad pleading was done by me. I'm accountable for my actions. It's primarily my fault.

Good lawyer analogies, I've been sitting here trying to come up with one that I thought Scoop would understand and he's provided me one.

I would say your last sentence is not entirely true.

If a high-stakes case is assigned to the newest lawyer just out of law school and he screws up I would say that is primarily the head of the firms fault for assigning a task to a person he is not experienced to handle.

If a high-profile murder case is being handled, but the firm will only approve a evidence discovery budget equivalent to fighting a traffic accident, I don't blame the lawyer for not proving his case.

 

[JeffJewell]

Not to argue, but to futher explore the Fortress of Solitude, as it were...

It has nothing to do with Hester or Chester. It's not cohesive with the DinoRama story. And it could have been made cohesive.

...I think this is a classic case of personal opinion. PW is what Chester and Hester thought kids would like to ride... that _is_ the story of DinoRama: Chester and Hester put up some crap for the kids. They made their crap nominally better than their fictional competitors' crap by stapling up brightly colored plywood scientists.

I understand you don't like it. I'm with you, brother.

It's just I really don't understand the "not cohesive" complaint.

Simply saying that if Eisner screws up (like he did) and approves a lousy budget, then Imagineering is off the hook for whatever the result is short-sighted.

No one's off the hook, but I really think it's focusing on the execution of a specific project that's short-sighted; particularly when there appear to long-term business strategies profoundly out of whack.

Jeff

 

[DVC-Landbaron]

Scoop:

No one's off the hook, but I really think it's focusing on the execution of a specific project that's short-sighted; particularly when there appear to long-term business strategies profoundly out of whack.

That's all I've been trying to say!

 

[DVC-Landbaron]

At the risk of beating a perfectly dead horse…

Thanks for the inspiration Hope. I can finally rest easy now that Uncle Mike has been vindicated.

This got me to thinking. (A dangerous thing!) I think there’s an awful lot of truth said in jest sometimes. And this is a fine example.

Now Scoop, my man. You’ve said a lot of derogatory things in this thread about Disney. Very out of character for, you will admit. But I can appreciate that in the name of honesty, you had to call it as you saw it.

Now, I realize that it is only due to your disappointment with Dino-rama, and that you are still the car #1 navigator if not the driver!! But I can’t remember at any other time, you getting so down on Disney. Actually and publicly saying that the concept, from start to finish kinda… well… sucks! (I’m paraphrasing so please allow a little literary license). Do I have this straight so far? Have you ever said anything like this before? If you did, I don’t remember. Sorry.

But if I’m right, doesn’t it seem a little strange to you, that the very first time the Scoop has a major problem with Disney’s philosophy, to this magnitude, he tries to deflect a bit of the blame off his hero (as I perceive it) and place it at the feet of his underlings (and the only people in Disney that car #3 people have any respect for).

Doesn’t anyone else think it a bit strange? Or am I looking at this wrong?

 

[mrtoadslastride]

Originally posted by DVC-Landbaron

But if I’m right, doesn’t it seem a little strange to you, that the very first time the Scoop has a major problem with Disney’s philosophy, to this magnitude, he tries to deflect a bit of the blame off his hero (as I perceive it) and place it at the feet of his underlings (and the only people in Disney that car #3 people have any respect for).

Be careful, if you get him to move to car 3 who will be left in car 1 to debate with???

Originally posted by DVC-Landbaron


Doesn’t anyone else think it a bit strange? Or am I looking at this wrong?

I don't know if it is strange or not, but depending on how you look at it in this instance Scoop may actually have been harder on Disney (and closer to car 4) than the rest of us. Instead of just pointing out the problems with Eisner's leadership, he is calling into question work by some of the underlings. Maybe Scoop jumped all the way from car 1 to car 4!

 

[Another Voice]

“If you are forced to create a "road side carnival" then create the most cohesive story possible. Design the most elaborate story possible. One ride of PW reveals, IMHO, that Primeval Whirl's story has nothing to do with Triceratops Spin story or the games story or even the large Dinosaur icon story.”

But Mr. Scoop – aren’t tacky roadside carnivals primarily identified has having unelaborated, uncohesive elements without a story. Could it be the fact that you found area so utter lacking in texture and subtext is proof that Dino-Rama ACHIEVED its design goals? From the pictures I’ve seen, both the parking lot location and the tacky carnival elements are masterfully achieved. There are even parking stripes in the ground. That’s detail! ‘Whirl’ is obviously a tacky, cheap and carny take on a Disney style ride – EXACTLY what you find in tacky road-side tourist traps. Of course it doesn’t have a story and it doesn’t have details, it’s not supposed to.

Wouldn’t a richly detailed, immersive “Disney” experience be exactly the opposite of the road-side carnival theme? If you’re trying to build a replica of International Drive, you don’t make it look like Rodeo Drive and put a Ritz Carlton in the middle of the street. So if you’re trying to build a tacky roadside carnival – you don’t build a Disney-class attraction in the middle of stunning landscaping.

Perhaps, my friend, the designers did an absolutely amazingly wonderful job with the theme they were given. Maybe that’s the real problem here.

 

[PKS44]

hopemax, AV, and Landbaron-kudos on explaining precisely why the whole "Blame the Imagineers" storyline lacks a cohesive structure....AV's explanation is perfect---the law firm examples are perfect...given a decent budget the associates may have had a great case- but the court never got to see it- the court record has no evidence of it because the bosses never let them present the case the way they wanted....but the law firm idea is not really close enough because top lawyers probably don't approve and green light individual things- I don't know about how law firms work, but that is what we are told---At Disney there is no comparison to the the hierarchy---I am certain that no Imagineer has ever snuck an inferior project past management...the bosses accepted and green lighted what chad calls inferior work...it is the boss's responsibility to demand better...that is what managers do... if any of you were the manager overseeing this project what would you have done? A)Greenlighted it the way it is or
B)insisted on change either better story or ask for more money from on high? No matter which choice is made- YOU- not the Imagineers- are responsible for what is there.

Paul

 

[Lesley]

EEEEEEEEEEEEEEKKKKKKKKKKKK!

I think I've wandered onto the bizzaro Rumors Board....where scoop slams Disney and Landbaron and AV are defending........



And yes, I do understand that this is just one instance...but, whoa, sure is weird to read! Now I know why I find you all so entertaining.

 

[DVC-Landbaron]

Be careful, if you get him to move to car 3 who will be left in car 1 to debate with???

Yeah! You’re right! Car #1 sure seems to be getting smaller and smaller. Are they driving a gremlin now? With so many joining Car #3, we're thinking about going with ‘Magic on Demand’ buses. Now there’s a concept!!!

Maybe Scoop jumped all the way from car 1 to car 4!

Scoop!!!??? Is there room in car four? Maybe I can join you!!

 

[mrtoadslastride]

Originally posted by DVC-Landbaron
Are they driving a gremlin now?

Now that's a mental picture! When I think of Scoop and Duck I will have a picture of Wayne and Garth in a Gremlin jammin to Bohemian Rhapsody!!! If they have the built in Twizzler dispenser like Garth's, maybe I will have to join them!

Surely ME could kick in to upgrade them to a gently used '89 Chevette!

Well, I am off to the airport for my trip. I'll see if I can bother some off duty CM's on their way to clock out, and we'll give Alladin another shot for Scoop.