Points for Disney Collection 2002

[Covman]

I booked the Grand Floridian for marathon weekend (January 6, 2002) for my wife and myself back in April. I was told that I would get a letter when the 2002 points were established. Based on the 2001 point structure (116 points for Friday/Saturday/Sunday) I was expecting somewhere around 130-140 point range for this year. I got the letter today.......

189 points for 2 weekend nights and one weekday at the Grand Floridian during Adventure season (an increase of over 60%). I have been out on vacation for a week and a half so I'm not up to date on the latest news, so if I've missed something, let me know.

I am calling MS tomorrow, to find out what the whole story is. I'll keep everyone posted. Thanks in advance for any insights you can provide.

 

[mouseclick1]

Wow! Hopefully they have made some sort of mistake! Please let us know what you find out!

 

[PamOKW]

That is a pretty big jump. I can't seem to find my 2001 chart but I'm assuming it's 26 for weekdays and 45 for weekends. It's been that rate since at least 1999. Keeping my fingers-crossed for all of us that it was an error. (The 2002 points haven't been posted on the Member Site yet. I just checked.)

I'll wait to hear if this is true. If it is, I have one theory about why.

 

[Covman]

Confirmed that it is 189 points for the three nights.

The rep confirmed that the points had gone up. I said by 62%- that is unbelievable- it was cheaper to pay cash then use the point- She said DVC had no control over what the
resorts charged for points, they all went up. I said aren't members
complaining-- she said they are cancelling reservations.

That's what I know.

We can get Grand Floridian with Concierge for less than $1600 (with pasta dinner for two pre-mararthon included) so we now have a decision to make. Thoughts? (Or Garden view for less than $1200).

 

[DVCDAVE]

This is horrible ! What a ripoff ! We should all boycott the Hotels for a year, and watch those points come down ! It is ironic this post came today, I was abut to call and add a stay in a cabin at FW during our stay in March at VWL, (should be 40 pts.) Forget it if it is going to cost me 70 points.

 

[PamOKW]

I sure hope they distribute the point charts soon. If they are making big jumps like that people may need to change their plans.

Changes in point charts has always been a possibility but I can't recall it happening in the past.

My theory is that by renting points out to strangers at a rate that undercuts Disney, we are doing ourselves a disservice. If people can come here or to E-Bay etc. and book a room at a DVC resort for 1/2 what Disney is charging, they will do it. Then Disney has to work that much harder to book the rooms members have turned over in exchanges. They have to lower their prices. Then they don't have the cash to give to the resort where the trade was made.

People have reported booking a 2 bedroom at OKW for December at $269 per night. The rack rate is $459 and if they get the discount after 12/20 that's versus the rack rate of $730. Now, the rack rates are comparable to GF rack rates and would be an even exchange. If Disney is only getting half the rack rate for the room, they can't do an even exchange with the GF and will have to increase the points they charge DVC members to stay in the other resorts.

I appreciate people being stuck with points from time to time but I really think the widespread rental of points is hurting everyone. It is setting up a secondary market for the resorts that works against the DVC balance. Just MHO....

 

[Lesley]

Makes me glad I didn't book the Poly or AKL with points on our next trip! We had decided to try VWL using our add on anyway...

If the points have gone up that much the Disney Collection is pretty much out for good for us...there's one exchange option that's no longer really an option. Good thing I've planned to use my points at the DVC resorts.

 

[Lisa F]

How disappointing! Before staying at a disney collection resort was a splurge but still within the realm of reason... Now the cost is just ridiculous. I know when we bought into dvc that all we were really guaranteed is the point schedule at the resort that we bought in at, but it's still EXTREMELY disappointing that the "flexibility" of DVC seems to be going by the wayside as Disney makes it increasingly more expensive to use our points at new DVC resorts and now the other Disney resorts on property.

I had heard that the reason that the 2002 point charts were taking so long to come out is because they were finally going to add point levels for concierge rooms at some of the hotels... I wonder if they got rid of being able to get regular rooms at hotels that have concierge and those prices are for concierge rooms?

Lisa

 

[Lesley]

Interesting thought, Lisa. That would be kind of nice and worth using more points....but 60% higher still seems like a lot.

 

[DVCDAVE]

PAMOKW--- I understand everything you said. But, how does the 2002 point schedule change anything. The secondary rental market isn't going to go away. Members can still be able to rent out their points for OKW for $269, Disney would still be out their rack rate. Seems to me the only ones being punished by this new point schedule is DVC'ers.

I think the whole matter is much deeper than it appears, it must be something in the way Disney accounts for these exchanges on their books. Maybe they feel that during these slow times that it is much easier to clear inventory of rooms in a Hotel for $380/ night, then it is to re-rent your DVC room for $498/night, so they realy don't want your DVC points right now. Remember, up until last year occupancy levels were running 98%, now they are 78%. If POP Century opens it will be even less.

One thing for certain is this, not only do we DVC'ers have to live with this, so does the DVC sales force when objections are raised. (Assuming potential buyers take the time to look, as we did). No matter what, this change has certainly detracted from all of ours DVC investment.

 

[Covman]

I do want to remind everyone that mine is but one example. It would be interesting to see the entire point schedule to see what the increases are across the board and then determine the overall pattern.

I am concerned personally because I signed a blank check back in April to stay at the GF and the price went up dramatically. Had I know the true point cost I would have booked OKW or BW. I haven't asked yet if there is availability to stay at either of those because I promised my wife that for supporting me for all the time it takes to train for the Marathon that we would have stay at the GF for the actual event.

 

[Rock'n Robin]

If you look at this and at the rising cost of cruising on points, it seems Disney is encouraging us to stay at our "homes" or not stay at all--I wonder how high the non-Disney exchanges will go next? It sure makes the "collection" part of the DVC video look like a lot of hooey.
Robin M.

 

[DVCDAVE]

COVMAN--Are you saying that the cost may higher because of the marathon is scheduled that weekend?

 

[dianeschlicht]

When we first bought in, I thought it would be nice to do a GF or Poly trip once, but after staying in our first 2 bedroom at OKW, I just don't seem to care about going back to a hotel room no matter where it is. If you had told me this information 5 years ago I would have paniced an possible not purchased, but now that I have experienced DVC, I just don't care. I enjoy my "home" too much!

 

[Joeblack]

To me, it doesnt' make much sense to use the same amount or points as a 2-bedroom villa to stay in a room which is smaller than a DVC studio.

Still, the Disney Collection is a "last resort" DVCers have when they have to use their points and nothing else is available. It happened to me last year wen I found out my wife was pregnant and had to cancel my 2 week trip to a stiudio in BWV. I was offered 1 week at YC, which I almost took, but thanks to advice in the boards I got 4 days at aa 1-br at BWV and 3 days at OKW. Had I not gotten lucky and reserved the 1 br villas, i would have had to go witht the YC.

If the price jump covman talks about is true, then I will just rent my points or give them away to my family before using them for the Disney Collection.

 

[mouseclick1]

I think that by raising the Disney Collection points, we may actually encourage even more owners to rent out their points. Let's say a DVC owner really wants to try out the AKL. The 2002 rack rate in early Feb. for a savannah room is $270. According to the 2001 chart, the points required for a S-Th stay would be 30 points per night. This rate would pretty even if you figure $10 per point compared to the room($299.70 with tax). If the points do go significantly higher, I can see where people would find it more cost effective to simply rent out the points, then pay for their room with the cash from the rental, and even have some spending $$ left over. Of course there are many that would not go this route, but I wonder how many would under these circumstances, especially if a DVC resort is unavailable for specific dates? What do you think?

 

[Covman]

To DVCDave,

Just to clarify my earlier posting, I really want to see the entire point list just in case I happened to hit the most extreme point increase of any out there -- The story of my life

I'm wondering if maybe its because its marathon time or just maybe the GF in Adventure season simply went up far more than anything else. I want to see all the data before I draw any conclusion about how bad (or ok?) these changes might be.

 

[DVCDAVE]

COVMAN-- I understand, I just checked the members site and it isn't up there yet. I am going to cal MS tomarrow, I want to add on a day to our already scheduled March vacation at VWL, we were thinking about getting a cabin at FW, I will do some inquiring then about the 2002 point schedule for premier season. Good Luck COVMAN, lets hope this is isolated, otherwise we will all suffer.

Buy the way, after doing some more thinkiing about this I believe PAMOKW may be wrong, or at least backward on this issue. This may actually ENCOURAGE more DVC rentals in the secondary market. For instance, if I have points that I can't use because the DVC resort is all booked up, right now I would turn to the Disney Collection as a second choice. If this is true that the schedule is inflated, I very might well rethink and rent my points out, and take the cash. Personally I think this will cause a lot more rental activity, not less.

 

[mistermouse]

IF it happens that 2002 Collection points increase by any amount greater than the hotel inflation rate (say 5-10%), then DVC'ers are essentially being told the program has come to an end. We can ponder any number of reasons why Disney would want to shut down the Collection for DVC, but none of the potential reasons indicated in this thread seem to provide any fully logical reason for such a move. Time will tell... (however, if it is true that we are seeing 50% + increases it does almost seem like a personal attack on folks who have signed up for Disney Vacation Club...but, why?). Anyway, we are happy at OKW, VWL, HHI, VB and BWV - if we feel the urge to stay at another deluxe WDW hotel, we'll pay the best available rate we can get and be happy to be at the place we love the best. We we're sold "the world," but perhaps we are just being reminded who is in charge...?

 

[PamOKW]

I'm not saying the increase in resort points would cause people to rent or not rent their points. My theory is that people not using their points for purely personal reasons as the DVC concept was designed....vacations at WDW or elsewhere, treating friends, allowing friends to use points (even for a charge)...but rather setting up a side business of renting DVC points for a profit when they are unable to use them may have contributed to throwing the DVC system out of whack. For 10 years there has been little or no adjustment to the World of Resorts program, at least nothing that was drastically noticeable. Now, that there is an increase in members and an increase in rental activity on the Internet that attempts to compete with WDW, the demand of people trying to book through CRO may have decreased and the price they can charge these renters may also have decreased.


Of course, I may still be completely off the wall with this concept.