RESALE POLICY CHANGE!

[skier_pete]

From my broker as of 10:15AM:

We are sending out notices to all Buyers today that includes the Disney notice from Monday and the Disney decision to not honor sales made prior to April 4 as they stated they would.

The reversal of the Disney decision came at 5:09 pm last evening and we have 500+ buyers to notify today.

Disney will not honor the Membership discounts for you.

Disney can be reached at 1 800 800-9800 option 2

This - far and away SUCKS the most about this change. I truly feel bad for someone that made a purchase and they are changing the rules mid-stream. Admittedly Disney always had the right to do it, but it's Dirty Pool.

Thinking about it - if they had stripped the discounts from me as a resale owner from 2014 as opposed to just future resale buyers, I would be annoyed but I don't think it would really change my current ownership. However, it would affect how I travel and more than likely have reduced my urge to get more points. While we haven't done it yet, we are trying to plot out a future where we would do multiple trips in a yearly span to take advantage of APs. Without access to the APs, we would probably not do this.

The merchandise discount matters not at all. Disney Visa gives the same merchandise discount, though maybe not at as many locations. The food discounts are nice - but removing them likely wouldn't alter our plans much.

The member events seem to hardly matter. Their has never been a member event while we were there, and I certainly wouldn't schedule a trip just for one of these member events.

Really when I was buying in one of the things that board vets stressed was "don't count on ANY of the perks" and that's the way I always looked at it. I'm getting a discounted room - stuff beyond that might motivate longer/more trips, but the basic room is what I want.

 

[disneynutz]

Disney is in the business to make money. They provide the illusion of a a magical place where people can be happy. They call this being on stage, maintaining the illusion but it's the guest who makes themselves happy.

The problem is that these changes, the letter and the way that the change was implemented, lessens the illusion and makes it clear that all Disney wants is our money, that can be a hard pill to swallow.

Sending emails to the people who made the changes won't do any good, you need to find outside world wide media sources who's publishing of negative Disney will catch the attention of Disney's board of directors, the financial community, and their share holders.

Bill

 

[Sophie_inBflo]

This - far and away SUCKS the most about this change. I truly feel bad for someone that made a purchase and they are changing the rules mid-stream. Admittedly Disney always had the right to do it, but it's Dirty Pool.

Honestly, when the news first broke and we thought it would apply to us (we were still awaiting ROFR at that point), we were "OK" (-ish) with the change, grumbling, but understood that it was their right to do. But then we were assured by our broker (and she showed screenshots of her conversations with Disney) that we would be grandfathered since we signed the contract in March. So when Disney went back on that yesterday at 5pm, that's when we got really ticked off.

The merchandise discount matters not at all. Disney Visa gives the same merchandise discount, though maybe not at as many locations. The food discounts are nice - but removing them likely wouldn't alter our plans much.

This isn't entirely true- the Visa discount is only on purchases over $50. The DVC (or AP) discount is for any purchase. There were several times on our last trip where I would spend $20-$30 at a store, so this one does make a difference to my spending. The AP discount is probably the biggest kicker. With the discount, it only takes 1.5 trips to recoup the cost. But without the discount, it's at least 2 full trips.

 

[nolanboys]

I just looked on the website of the resale company that we used years ago and they have a great letter explaining everything. They stated that they received conflicting information from Disney last evening about those going through the process now and will be updating when it is resolved. Hopefully it will work out for those in the process. Although Disney has the right to change, their last change had a grace period. I know they are all about their bottom line, but going about it with a little bit of grace matters.

 

[ziravan]

Honestly, if I were in process right now, I'd eat the deposit and back out.

1. If this sours me on DVC, a few grand is a small price to pay to not be on the hook for thousands more for years.

2. If I still wanted to be a quasi-member (renter with the privilege of booking myself), there will be fluxuations in the resale market. I think they will be permanent but even if temporary, buying in 2 months might be cheaper than the lost deposit.

 

[Mbm1014]

So who should we contact then?? Our voices must be heard..those of us in the process, that are extremely hurt and betrayed by this, who have money invested, need to be heard..it is just not right, and it is cruel and heartless and not 'disney' like way to treat their newest 'members' who now feel they are not members..

 

[supersnoop]

Re Email:
Ken.potrock@disney.com
Karl.holz@disney.com

My broker at dvc resale market encouraged me to voice my displeasure here. Currently have a contract in ROFR, sent 3/14

I don't think these guys are the right ones to hear your complaint. I'd focus on Bob Chapek (Chairman of parks) and Alan Braverman (General Counsel).

We won't be issued member cards.

I'm not sure all the smoke has cleared yet, but has this really been confirmed? Issuing member cards seems to be a DVC function, not a DVD function.

 

[ScubaCat]

Sending emails to the people who made the changes won't do any good, you need to find outside world wide media sources who's publishing of negative Disney will catch the attention of Disney's board of directors, the financial community, and their share holders.

That's not entirely true. Yes, those things would help, but direct contact is important as well. I'd also include dvcmembersatisfactionteam@disneyvacationclub.com as well, though, as it's more likely to get read that way.

I remember when airlines first instituted baggage fees. American and United waived the fees for people (grandfathered in) who had already purchased tickets, but Delta decided to stick it to everyone immediately. Eventually, with enough letter writing, Delta relented and waived the fees on people who had already purchased tickets prior to the announcement.

You're absolutely right about the "good will" factor, though. Living in Atlanta at the time, I began flying Airtran (now Southwest) immediately when they did that and I have only been on ONE Delta flight since due to lack of an alternative. It won't kill them, but it could make a little difference at the margins. Then again, Disney seems to be immune to this sort of thing.

 

[Sophie_inBflo]

Honestly, if I were in process right now, I'd eat the deposit and back out.

1. If this sours me on DVC, a few grand is a small price to pay to not be on the hook for thousands more for years.

2. If I still wanted to be a quasi-member (renter with the privilege of booking myself), there will be fluxuations in the resale market. I think they will be permanent but even if temporary, buying in 2 months might be cheaper than the lost deposit.

we're far enough along that we would loose around $1k- and this is a very real discussion we're having right now: if we wait 1-2 months, might point cost go low enough that we could recoup this $1k?

 

[robinb]

From my broker as of 10:15AM:

We are sending out notices to all Buyers today that includes the Disney notice from Monday and the Disney decision to not honor sales made prior to April 4 as they stated they would.

The reversal of the Disney decision came at 5:09 pm last evening and we have 500+ buyers to notify today.

Disney will not honor the Membership discounts for you.

Disney can be reached at 1 800 800-9800 option 2

Woah. That really sucks.

 

[Sophie_inBflo]

You're absolutely right about the "good will" factor, though. Living in Atlanta at the time, I began flying Airtran (now Southwest) immediately when they did that and I have only been on ONE Delta flight since due to lack of an alternative. It won't kill them, but it could make a little difference at the margins. Then again, Disney seems to be immune to this sort of thing.

I wonder how many contracts were / are in ROFR, or were somewhere in the signed-but-not-closed status. Someone else posted that their broker said they have to notify 500+ contracts, but that seemed awfully high. Regardless, I'm wondering how much Disney is saving by not offering these extras to that group of people, because we're not talking about *that many*.

 

[hbrother]

can someone post in clear terms what I will lose out on, Because of this change. My contact does not close until 4/22/16 so I know I am lossing out on something juts dont understand excatly what

I don't think clear terms are out there. I did find this on dvc info: https://*******.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/MEADSFinal.pdf

It is a bit complicated, so I really cannot just pull out the pertinent bits. From what I read pool hopping, Top of the World, and member lounges are not mentioned. (Maybe I missed it.)

However, from a call to Disney today, they will not be available.

Oh, yeah and I just got word I passed ROFR.

 

[hayesdvc]

I have an add on contract that passed ROFR the same day this policy change was published. I received the following email last night around 10:30 from the broker:

The Timeshare Store received information from Disney this afternoon regarding the change DVC made on 4/4/16. We thought it only applied to new files that were sent to Disney for ROFR after 4/3/16 but it applies to anything that hasn't been recorded before 4/3/16.
Any closings that take place after 4/4/16 will not receive a member ID card and the incidental benefits will not pass on to the new owner. Disney informed us that they can take away incidental benefits at any time without notice.

 

[southerngirl528]

So who should we contact then?? Our voices must be heard..those of us in the process, that are extremely hurt and betrayed by this, who have money invested, need to be heard..it is just not right, and it is cruel and heartless and not 'disney' like way to treat their newest 'members' who now feel they are not members..

I agree that advance notice of the changes would have been a far "nicer" thing to do and I'm sorry for your and others' similar situation, but folks you were/are buying a TIMESHARE, not a discount program. I've been a member over 20 years, discounts come and go. The ONLY thing you and I are guaranteed is accommodations at our home DVC resort. And that all by itself is pretty awesome, I can tell you from much, much experience. Only you can decide if you want to back out, but not only is DVC fully within their rights but this is pretty normal stuff with timeshares and other businesses. Every business wants/needs folks to buy products from them directly. Truthfully it seems a bit unfair to me that resale members HAVE gotten the same perks all these years when they did not pay nearly as much as those buying direct. There's more than one side to this coin...

I don't think these guys are the right ones to hear your complaint. I'd focus on Bob Chapek (Chairman of parks) and Alan Braverman (General Counsel).

Everyone can write letters, I am big on writing letters as they are generally far more impactful than just telling someone your concerns. But this is beating a dead horse. That train left the station from Day 1 of DVC. Perks and discounts have never, ever, EVER been an integral, legally promised part of the DVC timeshare and I can tell you my now very old docs state this in verbiage that no one could deny.

I'm not sure all the smoke has cleared yet, but has this really been confirmed? Issuing member cards seems to be a DVC function, not a DVD function.

Yes, it has been confirmed. CM's were sent talking points about this new policy. And yes, going forward from 4/04 resale buyers that do not already own w/DVC will NOT be receiving member cards. They stopped printing them for members as a courtesy a few weeks ago. Members can no longer get member cards on property at the sales centers. Members that bought prior to 4/04/16 will still have member cards and/or can download a digital look-alike version. New resale members that bought as of 4/04/16 will have a digital download that looks nothing like a member card. It will have their Mbr# and info but will clearly show a difference.

 

[southerngirl528]

From what I read pool hopping, Top of the World, and member lounges are not mentioned. (Maybe I missed it.)

However, from a call to Disney today, they will not be available.

d

I have a few friends that work for DVC, and the talking points they got state that Pool hopping and TOWL WILL still be included. That's what I got from them directly after this all broke. I knew they would have details. If a CM told you no pool hopping or TOWL I think they were misinformed. Once you are a member you can log into your account and it will outline all privileges you will and will not have.

 

[robinb]

I wonder how many contracts were / are in ROFR, or were somewhere in the signed-but-not-closed status. Someone else posted that their broker said they have to notify 500+ contracts, but that seemed awfully high. Regardless, I'm wondering how much Disney is saving by not offering these extras to that group of people, because we're not talking about *that many*.

Ther OP (I think) used the word "petty" and in my mind not grandfathering in people with signed contracts before 4/4 is ridiculously petty. How many people can we be talking about?

Ssssshhhhh! Listen, Disney's talking.

 

[nitrot150]

I agree that advance notice of the changes would have been a far "nicer" thing to do and I'm sorry for your and others' similar situation, but folks you were/are buying a TIMESHARE, not a discount program. I've been a member over 20 years, discounts come and go. The ONLY thing you and I are guaranteed is accommodations at our home DVC resort. And that all by itself is pretty awesome, I can tell you from much, much experience. Only you can decide if you want to back out, but not only is DVC fully within their rights but this is pretty normal stuff with timeshares and other businesses. Every business wants/needs folks to buy products from them directly. Truthfully it seems a bit unfair to me that resale members HAVE gotten the same perks all these years when they did not pay nearly as much as those buying direct. There's more than one side to this coin...



Yes, it has been confirmed. CM's were sent talking points about this new policy. And yes, going forward from 4/04 resale buyers that do not already own w/DVC will NOT be receiving member cards. They stopped printing them for members as a courtesy a few weeks ago. Members can no longer get member cards on property at the sales centers. Members that bought prior to 4/04/16 will still have member cards and/or can download a digital look-alike version. New resale members that bought as of 4/04/16 will have a digital download that looks nothing like a member card. It will have their Mbr# and info but will clearly show a difference.

I literally ordered a new card for my DH since he didn't get an updated one a month or two ago (long story). And that was Monday I think, so they are still sending them out.

 

[dankil13]

I'm not sure all the smoke has cleared yet, but has this really been confirmed? Issuing member cards seems to be a DVC function, not a DVD function.

The email from my broker specifically stated we won't be issued member cards. This was posted from several other brokers as well. Its one thing to take away incidental benefits, if that's what you want to call them. I find it rather insulting to not provide member ID cards for folks who are committing to paying annual dues for the next few decades as well as spending their annual vacations at Disney. And the way it was handled makes it look like Steve Harvey is running their communications department!

 

[jimim]

I've said this before---more than once---but it bears repeating:

Disney is a company that makes money by selling happiness. That's not the same thing as "Disney wants me, personally, to be happy." Indeed, Disney wants to get as much money per "unit happiness" as it can. In turn, we consumers would prefer to get more happiness for our buck. So, despite the fact that Disney sells happiness, the company is also in conflict with its consumers.

Nearly every long-term Disney fan eventually encounters this realization, and that day is never a pleasant day. But, if you can live with the mercenary aspects of the relationship, it's still not half bad spending money with a company selling happiness.

I realized this last year and my buddy busted me all trip saying I'm being miserable and such.

But a lot of what I was saying is happening right now and he took it back the other night.

It's kinda sad knowing as much as I know over the years but I will say I would never trade it in for all the people I have met and that now r part of my life. My buddy and his family is the best example. He's family are now part of my family and that is because of Disney.

That's my new way of viewing Disney Magic.

jim

 

[hbrother]

we're far enough along that we would loose around $1k- and this is a very real discussion we're having right now: if we wait 1-2 months, might point cost go low enough that we could recoup this $1k?

Honestly, if I were in process right now, I'd eat the deposit and back out.

1. If this sours me on DVC, a few grand is a small price to pay to not be on the hook for thousands more for years.

2. If I still wanted to be a quasi-member (renter with the privilege of booking myself), there will be fluxuations in the resale market. I think they will be permanent but even if temporary, buying in 2 months might be cheaper than the lost deposit.

I'm trying to make this decision now. I had hoped to not pass ROFR, got word I passed this morning.