What is going on with Disney parks?

[clarker99]

Since you asked, what I want is:

Longer hours - Not like 20 years ago, like 5 years ago. No reason MK should close at 8 or 9.
Less Parties - No reason MK should close at 6 on 4 out of the 7 days of some of the busiest weeks.
Not running half capacity during "slower" times
Building out capacity - main street theater, for example
Night Time parade - While I'm dreaming....

ETA: The end of this new land strategy of 1 great ride and 1 "we had to save some money" ride.

MK is a problem. Tomorrowland needs a major overhaul and ride/attraction updates. Tron will only paper over the cracks until a proper refurb can be done.

Parties are not going away and that is a legit gripe. Charging for a full park day when it closes early is pretty shady.

They are slowly building out the parks. Pandora, SWGE, Epcot overhaul with new high capacity rides have/will all add capacity. Also, sounds like both Pandora and SWGE have expansion pads. Disney like to slow roll things so it always seems like there is something new when you go every other year. The 1 e-ticket, 1 lesser ride strategy isnt a Disney only thing. Daigon Alley only has 1 ride. Until Hagrids, Hogsmeade did this. Right or wrong I dont know. I still really enjoy SWGE, Pandora,Toy Story land, Cars Land, Wizarding worlds etc. Guessing Nintendo will have same strategy.

Park hours are an interesting one. With young kids, we are never at the parks that late bc you have to get up early the next day and do it all over again but on one visit to DLR we let our DS fall asleep in the stroller and my wife and I took turns walking on to rides till midnight. It was def nice. The next day was tough tho.

In terms of parades and stuff? I feel that is a personal preference. We dont stop for parades or the fireworks anymore.

 

[nickg420]

I absolutely disagree with you, but that's ok.

We can agree to disagree

But let me just point out something....

Why do you think they give AP holders free parking, and discounts on merch , resort stays, and restaurants? It's not because Disney is nice and want to thank you for being an AP holder... It's simply because they WANT to entice AP Holders to spend more money on all those things! Why? Because MOST, again not ALL, but MOST AP holders do not spend much money in those areas.

They aren't giving those discounts out of the goodness of their Disney themed heart! They are doing it to drive revenue where it is lacking from a that AP holder demographic. They would much rather have 80% of a retail price on a piece of merch than 100% of $0 in merch. Same with resort stays....They make $0 when you stay off property, they'll gladly take the 75%-80% to entice you stay on property. Because they will make that up when you use the 20% discount to buy merch you wouldn't have normally bought.

I assure you...AP Holders are not huge buckets of Revenue when compared to other visitors, and they are not driving many financial decisions.

 

[BrianL]

I’m still not over Navi river.....

If built out as originally planned, would have been pretty good and maybe even taken some weight off of FOP.

It could definitely use a little plussing and is a bit short, but it's still enjoyable. MFSR has serious issues. The most enjoyable part is the queue and pre-show rooms.

 

[dlavender]

Ill completely disagree with the last statement. Everything else I understand but the last statement to me, just makes no sense. With a party of 4 Christmas Day we pulled BTMRR, 7DMT, Space, Pan, Jungle Cruise, POC, Haunted Mansion, Buzz then bounced to Ak and pulled FoP, Everest, Dinosaur, etc.

On any given weekend day we can go and with a party of 2-4 pull pretty much whatever we want. And the amount of FPs available is always easy to manage prior to about 6PM when they get difficult to maneuver around.

But we havent pulled FPs in advance in forever and we go every 2nd or 3rd weekend on a Saturday or Sunday. We wake up and on the drive over decide which park we want to go, pull 3 FPs, and then when we get tot he park refresh, refresh, refresh. As long as its a day we are in the mood to ride things. About a month ago on one day we did every eride at every park ( there was an after hours at MK but even without it had we skipped our dinner at Wave the results wouldve been the same) in a single day.

We are going next Saturday 22nd and havent pulled a FP yet and are planning to see how many FPs we will actually use ( Not burners and not just doing easy to get ones), we can pull in one day across 2 or 3 parks. Ive heard 21 is the highest anyone has heard, but, I think thats beatable as we can average in general 12-15 on any given day just at chill and enjoy speed.

So I disagree that FP+ Has taken away flexibility. Day of its quite easy.

I see this on here all the time. I'll just say we never have this luck. Perhaps its because we are a party of 5? I try breaking it up, but after about 5 minutes of constant searching I just don't feel like keeping my head in my phone anymore. Just want to enjoy the time with family. I'm glad this works out for apparently everyone but us. For example, in October during our 2 hour drive down, I literally sat in the passenger seat and refreshed the entire time. No 7DMT or even a SM before 9 PM could be had. It's anecdotal, and perhaps we just have extremely bad luck.

 

[ChipnDale79]

I see this on here all the time. I'll just say we never have this luck. Perhaps its because we are a party of 5? I try breaking it up, but after about 5 minutes of constant searching I just don't feel like keeping my head in my phone anymore. Just want to enjoy the time with family. I'm glad this works out for apparently everyone but us. For example, in October during our 2 hour drive down, I literally sat in the passenger seat and refreshed the entire time. No 7DMT or even a SM before 9 PM could be had. It's anecdotal, and perhaps we just have extremely bad luck.

I've found it works well for a party of 2, beyond that, it doesnt really work that well. Id say that what the previous poster was able to get was not common.

 

[SaintsManiac]

I see this on here all the time. I'll just say we never have this luck. Perhaps its because we are a party of 5? I try breaking it up, but after about 5 minutes of constant searching I just don't feel like keeping my head in my phone anymore. Just want to enjoy the time with family. I'm glad this works out for apparently everyone but us. For example, in October during our 2 hour drive down, I literally sat in the passenger seat and refreshed the entire time. No 7DMT or even a SM before 9 PM could be had. It's anecdotal, and perhaps we just have extremely bad luck.

I have never gotten Mine Train or Slinky. Believe it or not, FoP is the easiest one for me to get. I snagged 3 of them in a row last March. We are a party of 3, but it was Mardi Gras weekend and I was pretty dang shocked. I also scored it July 7 a couple of times. I give up after about 10 minutes, because I would rather be doing other things.

Soarin and Splash are also easy to get. I lucked out and got FEA once. I really think it's mostly luck and party size.

 

[dlavender]

I've found it works well for a party of 2, beyond that, it doesnt really work that well. Id say that what the previous poster was able to get was not common.

For "fun" I just tried to get either SM, PP, or 7DMT for the last 7 minutes straight for today. Anytime. Want to guess how many I got? 0

So if I'm in the park with my family, that's 7 minutes of not paying attention to anything else just constant refreshing that is eventually fruitless.....

I have to imagine some of the refresh "success" stories are more involved than is presented sometimes. Or, again, my luck is just awful.

 

[dlavender]

I have never gotten Mine Train or Slinky. Believe it or not, FoP is the easiest one for me to get. I snagged 3 of them in a row last March. We are a party of 3, but it was Mardi Gras weekend and I was pretty dang shocked. I also scored it July 7 a couple of times. I give up after about 10 minutes, because I would rather be doing other things.

Soarin and Splash are also easy to get. I lucked out and got FEA once. I really think it's mostly luck and party size.

I think we've snagged FOP once before too on the way down. But it was the one victory among a 100 defeats. Yeah, in the parks 10 minutes has been my max. And changing party size and snagging 2 here, then trying for 3 gets tiring. I just must have the worst timing/luck among the refreshers, lol

 

[ChipnDale79]

I think we've snagged FOP once before too on the way down. But it was the one victory among a 100 defeats. Yeah, in the parks 10 minutes has been my max. And changing party size and snagging 2 here, then trying for 3 gets tiring. I just must have the worst timing/luck among the refreshers, lol

We we're able to get FOP day off, however we had to get them in 2 groups of 2 and while refreshing for 15-20 minutes while the kids played in the boneyard (i think thats what its called)

 

[clarker99]

Cool...i love it when im told im wrong.

by the way, there are over 60 pages in this thread, there's another forum out there that had a thread very similar to this one that was just as long.

my point is, there is a disconnect somewhere between disney, and a lot of long term park-goes.

you can go ahead and toss attendance numbers and pricing out at me all you want to, that doesn't mean there isnt a disconnect.

I apologize. Didnt mean to offend.

The disconnect is that Disney is not the same company it was and peoples nostalgia drives a wedge. Disney has to move forward and accommodate a new and growing user base. They are adapting to changing demographics. You and 1000’s of others will walk away and it will make no difference and this is prob what will bother former customers the most.

 

[LSUmiss]

For "fun" I just tried to get either SM, PP, or 7DMT for the last 7 minutes straight for today. Anytime. Want to guess how many I got? 0

So if I'm in the park with my family, that's 7 minutes of not paying attention to anything else just constant refreshing that is eventually fruitless.....

I have to imagine some of the refresh "success" stories are more involved than is presented sometimes. Or, again, my luck is just awful.

Exactly & a lot of us are saying that we don’t really assess value in how many rides we do but the overall “magic”. But, there is very little magic in trying to refresh for 45 min straight, in wall-to-wall ppl with an impatient toddler hanging off you.

 

[Brianstl]

I never said all AP holders didn't spend plenty of money at Disney. I'm simply saying you are the minority. Most AP holders do not spend money in that way, in fact most are in state and spend even less. No matter how you shake it AP holders as a whole are a drop in the bucket in terms of Revenue and do not drive any of Disney's decisions.

In state AP Holders, in state ticket buyers and in state resort guest are Walt Disney World's hedge against an economic downturn. Well, they at least they used to be. That is why they get in state discounts. The cost of travel to the parks is much cheaper for them and if Disney can get them in the habit of going they are less likely to stop going when money gets tighter.

 

[LSUmiss]

I apologize. Didnt mean to offend.

The disconnect is that Disney is not the same company it was and peoples nostalgia drives a wedge. Disney has to move forward and accommodate a new and growing user base. They are adapting to changing demographics. You and 1000’s of others will walk away and it will make no difference and this is prob what will bother former customers the most.

Maybe or maybe enough ppl walk away & those new ppl who took our place don’t have the same nostalgia so less loyalty & eventually Disney’s luck runs out. The changing demographics is more of a throw away culture that seeks out the next best instagram sensation. That’s not sustainable. You need your loyal customers too.

 

[kymom99]

Maybe or maybe enough ppl walk away & those new ppl who took our place don’t have the same nostalgia so less loyalty & eventually Disney’s luck runs out. The changing demographics is more of a throw away culture that seeks out the next best instagram sensation. That’s not sustainable. You need your loyal customers too.

And that, I believe, is why they have to constantly be in a state of changes and upgrades these days. People today want new and exciting. They are trying to stay relevant.

 

[Remy is Up]

We can agree to disagree

But let me just point out something....

Why do you think they give AP holders free parking, and discounts on merch , resort stays, and restaurants? It's not because Disney is nice and want to thank you for being an AP holder... It's simply because they WANT to entice AP Holders to spend more money on all those things! Why? Because MOST, again not ALL, but MOST AP holders do not spend much money in those areas.

They aren't giving those discounts out of the goodness of their Disney themed heart! They are doing it to drive revenue where it is lacking from a that AP holder demographic. They would much rather have 80% of a retail price on a piece of merch than 100% of $0 in merch. Same with resort stays....They make $0 when you stay off property, they'll gladly take the 75%-80% to entice you stay on property. Because they will make that up when you use the 20% discount to buy merch you wouldn't have normally bought.

I assure you...AP Holders are not huge buckets of Revenue when compared to other visitors, and they are not driving many financial decisions.

We can certainly agree on that. I NEVER use discounts as validation to have an AP. Those mean absolutely zero to us. While we do purchase merchandise, the discount isnt anything of a true value to us. Staying on site, now that we are resident Ap holders, is something we will do maybe 3 times a year for long weekends, but, we also have a relative working at Disney and the Friends and family discount on resort stays is much better than AP discounts anyway. Food, eh. We do eat when there but we also have TIW because we eat at Sit downs and enjoy adult beverages which now has a lot of options on TIW. So that has value but its an extra 150/Year and we figure it pays for itself 3 or 4 times over a year based on our meal choices.
As long as the # of days we go a year, as previously stated 30-35, divided into the total AP price makes it worth it for us, then its valuable.
We agree that Ap holders are not buckets of revenue which is why I believe they are raising the price on AP to thin the herd so to speak. They make their money elsewhere on day and once or twice a year visitors, not AP holders, particularly resident AP holders. And while I dont think they drive financial decisions, I do believe they want less AP holders and will not add more benefits in order to dissuade that option.

 

[Brianstl]

The attendance numbers would suggest the parks have actually been slightly less crowded. While attendance has been basically flat over the past five business quarters for domestic Disney parks, those numbers are more spread out amongst the multiple extra separate ticket events that Disney has been adding.

Let's say on a day in October the Magic Kingdom has 45,000 through it's gates during regular park hours and then has 20,000 people through the gates for MNSH that night, total attendance will get 65,000 added to it. But,there weren't 65,000 people at the park that day for regular hours. Plus, many of those people are being counted twice because they attended both regular hours at one of the parks with their normal tickets and then attended MNSH.

 

[Remy is Up]

For "fun" I just tried to get either SM, PP, or 7DMT for the last 7 minutes straight for today. Anytime. Want to guess how many I got? 0

So if I'm in the park with my family, that's 7 minutes of not paying attention to anything else just constant refreshing that is eventually fruitless.....

I have to imagine some of the refresh "success" stories are more involved than is presented sometimes. Or, again, my luck is just awful.

Some of it is timing and understanding drops. Some of it is party size. MK doesnt have the drops the other parks do, but, it also doesnt have tiers.
I just went on and for 4 people in 3 refreshes saw BTMRR, Space, Pan. Took about 10 refreshes before stumbling onto a 7DMT. Epcot Soarin and FEA both came up within 5 refreshes. Studios RNRC, TSM, ToT all popped immediately. SDD took a few minutes but one did come up. Which is a surprise since its just past a drop time. Everything at AK came up immediately other than FoP but that drop time is upcoming so itll pop in a bit.

We are normally 2 or 3 but I added another friend with an AP to get me to 4 and everything seemed normal to me.

Again, we go a lot so the refresh is a second nature kind of thing and Im not even as adept at it as my wife is. But we generally just do it if we are in a FP line or want to do something in particular. What I have noticed is the people who consistently post about getting what they want when they want are generally resident APs who understand drops and how to refresh. And do it regularly. Again, new test in two weeks will be using 21+ FPs in one day and see what happens and what we pull.Not something we do all the time, but after doing the 4 park challenge and taking it even further ( which we wont do again EVER), a one day how many FPs can you pull will be interesting. We do tours and just casually enjoy the parks most days, but, now and then trying something challenging is fun.

 

[clarker99]

Maybe or maybe enough ppl walk away & those new ppl who took our place don’t have the same nostalgia so less loyalty & eventually Disney’s luck runs out. The changing demographics is more of a throw away culture that seeks out the next best instagram sensation. That’s not sustainable. You need your loyal customers too.

Anything can happen but I think this is wishful thinking. Even in this new Disney era, brand loyalty is being built across multiple generations. Story telling and building experiences are still what they do very well even though many don't realize it. 7 x $1billion box office movies last year (8 if you want to include Spider-Man). Everyone of those movies were remakes or sequels. Disney+ has >30million subs. Loyalty and love for their IP is real and people are paying for it.

 

[YesterDark]

We have been going for years multiple times a year so we are pretty up on all the tricks. The issues for us were the ridiculous security lines, transportation, character meals that ran 1-2 hours behind, and long fp lines. Young children can’t tolerate all that. So it’s even more frustrating when you do all the things you’re supposed to do to mitigate crowds & they still don’t work. Those were annoying inconveniences before going with little kids, but with them, it makes it much less enjoyable & often doesn’t seem worth the hassle. Like the pp said traveling with young kids is a chore no matter where you go, but it should be less of a chore when you go to place that’s supposedly for kids.

Don't know what to tell you then. Over the last 5 years I've done 3 trips with small kids and another one in just over a month. I've never had an issue with security lines, transportation or character meals.

 

[LSUmiss]

Don't know what to tell you then. Over the last 5 years I've done 3 trips with small kids and another one in just over a month. I've never had an issue with security lines, transportation or character meals.

Then consider yourself lucky b/c on multiple threads other ppl have reported having similar issues.