D.O.C.'s = Dis'ers of Color (Disney Fans of Color)

[TheMaxRebo]

I don't know if this was the exact story you saw, but I saw this "overheard by friends of Tiana" post on Twitter a few weeks ago that included an anecdote about a little girl whose mom wouldn't let her wear a Tiana dress.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1271459947335897089

I had seen that and was saddened and felt bad for the friends of Tiana that have to deal with that (and Naveen and I am sure Jasmine and Aladin and Mulan and others) ... and they not only have to hear that but have to smile through it!

I do wonder if some of those comments are more from a place of ignorance than hatred (not that it is an excuse but perhaps something that can be changed over time)

I also recently read this story (of a black actor who was cast as Hans in Frozen: Live at the Hyperion) ... a reminder that Disney is not immune from these things happening internally either and hopefully now can be a time for them to look inward as well

https://www.onstageblog.com/onstage...acist-treatment-backstage-at-disney-park-show

 

[TheMaxRebo]

Hi @Lindsey17 ,
Thanks for sharing. I think your suggestion about an exposé about Walt Disney’s views is interesting. Although I am no expert on Mr. Disney, I do think we should ask Michael Bowling if he would be interested in contributing a few posts to our thread. It might be a touchy subject, and it might not go over well unless Michael is a BLM ally? I will try dig something up and explore further.
Now the Idea of exploring “Friends of Tianna”, really caught my eye. @Lindsey17 Would you like to explore sources for a series “Friends of “ Stories/posts? I think this might be a worth while read.

Peace & Love,

I'll see what I can dig up. I know there is a FB for CM's, but I don't think you can join if you aren't or haven't been one. I'll see if I can find those posts again because it really is eye opening. I also think it would be great to get Michael's input even if not on this thread an episode of Connecting with Walt on some of these matters would be great. Since Disneyland opened in the 50's, was it segregated? From the short research I did, it appears it wasn't, but that was just a quick google search and who knows how credible the sources are.

I know on Connecting with Walt one of the guests that they have had on a few times is Jim Korkis who has written a ton of books about Disney and Walt and the Parks, etc. One of his books that I have read is called "Who's Afraid of Song of the South?" and tries to go into the history of the film and examine it (there are also additional chapters about other hidden things about Walt and the company that are scandalous/not family friendly). Now, I do think he might go too far in trying to defend Walt as his point is to share the other side of people that try to bash Walt (including using untruths about him), but he also specifically says Walt wasn't a Saint and had his issues as well. The forward from the book is written by legendary Disney animator Floyd Norman. Jim has also covered in other places about if Walt was antisemitic and other topics

I have found that book and other work by Jim to be interesting - though I must admit I am reading them through the eyes of a white person so perhaps they are doing more harm than good

 

[disneysteve]

I feel this news is relevant here, as we can discuss it respectfully. I am looking forward to this.
https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id...p-deal?platform=amp&__twitter_impression=true

I sincerely hope that Kaepernick ends up being the hero of this whole story. How fitting that would be.

 

[AKL Ranger]

Hello everyone,
I hope sharing lessons about the subtleties of race will not cause everyone here to experience A case of “ABS” Ally Burnout syndrome.
I am sharing a link to an article on CNN, regarding the
The words and phrases permeate nearly every aspect of our society.
"Master bedrooms" in our homes. "Blacklists" and "whitelists" in computing. The idiom "sold down the river" in our everyday speech.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/06/us/racism-words-phrases-slavery-trnd/index.html

 

[disneysteve]

I don't know if this was the exact story you saw, but I saw this "overheard by friends of Tiana" post on Twitter a few weeks ago that included an anecdote about a little girl whose mom wouldn't let her wear a Tiana dress.

What awful stories. I feel terrible for the CMs and also for the children who are being raised with such hatred from their parents.

 

[disneysteve]

I am sharing a link to an article on CNN, regarding the
The words and phrases permeate nearly every aspect of our society.

I saw that article a little while ago and was going to share it.

I have a friend who is a realtor in Florida who had posted a few weeks ago about the industry getting away from the term Master Bedroom so I was already aware of that. It is totally something that had never occurred to me as being problematic, but now I can't ever hear that term again without thinking that.

Honestly, I think a couple of things on that list might be a stretch, but the whole "black is bad; white is good" trope is so ingrained. We see it in books and movies over and over. Darth Vader, for example. Black magic. Lots of examples. So many terms are so far removed from their origin that 99.9% of people have no idea where the terms came from. I just learned this week about nitty gritty. I had no clue at all what that actually meant.

 

[AKL Ranger]

I sincerely hope that Kaepernick ends up being the hero of this whole story. How fitting that would be.

It is about time corporate America stepped up and did the right thing toward Mr. Kaepernick. Here is a peaceful man who‘s non-violent, peaceful protest has shined a mega-watt light in the face of racism here in America.
Calling the Norway Peace *Price nominating chairs, a Nobel Peace Prize might be in order.
All though all of the Nobel Prizes in (medicine, Sciences, Economics & Literature) are award by the Royal Swedish Academy, it is the Norwegian Nobel Commitee that awards the prize for Peace.
Ok maybe that might be a bit over the top, instead After the US Presidential inauguration in Jan 2021, I say Mr. Kaepernick is in line for the Presidential medal of Freedom.

So say we all.

 

[AKL Ranger]

I saw that article a little while ago and was going to share it.

I have a friend who is a realtor in Florida who had posted a few weeks ago about the industry getting away from the term Master Bedroom so I was already aware of that. It is totally something that had never occurred to me as being problematic, but now I can't ever hear that term again without thinking that.

Honestly, I think a couple of things on that list might be a stretch, but the whole "black is bad; white is good" trope is so ingrained. We see it in books and movies over and over. Darth Vader, for example. Black magic. Lots of examples. So many terms are so far removed from their origin that 99.9% of people have no idea where the terms came from. I just learned this week about nitty gritty. I had no clue at all what that actually meant.

See a white dove, and everyone says “aw look at the pretty white doves released at the wedding.” See a grey or dark colored pigeon “dirty bird, rat with wings.”
See a White man riding a horse with a White hat, “ our small western town is saved”, our town sitting out in the west on land stolen from the Native American Indians or Mexico.
See a cowboy riding into town wearing a Black hat “run for the hills, trouble just rode into town”. No actually the first cowboys were ex Black slaves doing the ranching work considered beneath the dignity of most White men.

I do not think that is too far of a stretch.

 

[disneysteve]

See a white dove, and everyone says “aw look at the pretty white doves released at the wedding.” See a grey or dark colored pigeon “dirty bird, rat with wings.”
See a White man riding a horse with a White hat, “ our small western town is saved”, our town sitting out in the west on land stolen from the Native American Indians or Mexico.
See a cowboy riding into town wearing a Black hat “run for the hills, trouble just rode into town”. No actually the first cowboys were ex Black slaves doing the ranching work considered beneath the dignity of most White men.

I do not think that is too far of a stretch.

Oh, not at all. It wasn't the "black is bad; white is good" thing that I meant was a stretch. Sorry if it sounded that way. I think that's right on the money.

 

[disneysteve]

After the US Presidential inauguration in Jan 2021, I say Mr. Kaepernick is in line for the Presidential medal of Freedom.

That would be amazing!

 

[JiminyCricket!]

I'm learning a lot from this conversation and appreciate the tone of everyone sharing

 

[AKL Ranger]

Has everyone heard of the term “Colorism”?
Colorism, a term believed to be first coined in 1982 by Pulitzer Prize
winner Alice Walker, was defined by her to mean the “prejudicial or preferential treatment of same-race people based solely on their color.”

Has everyone heard of the “Paper Bag” test?
Yes Dis’ers such a thing has existed Surfing Slavery in the 1800’s lighter skinned slaves were given duties around the plantation owners house, while darker Colored Slaves were given hard manual field work.
The Paper bag test was something that still made it way into the 1940’ and early 50’s.
Applying for jobs in the 1940/50’s many black would describe as being “lighter Skinned color/tone”, as though it were ana career boost. The shame is yes, it was often the thing that sealed the deal as to who got hired.
Light skinned domestic workers, handy men were considered less of a threat. Among African American community Black men were encouraged to marry lighter skinned Black women.
Hence the brown paper bag test, if you were darker than a paper bag you were considered too dark.

https://www.thoughtco.com/what-is-colorism-2834952

 

[disneysteve]

Black men were encouraged to marry lighter skinned Black women.

Was that in hopes of having lighter skinned offspring?

 

[Lindsey17]

I don't know if this was the exact story you saw, but I saw this "overheard by friends of Tiana" post on Twitter a few weeks ago that included an anecdote about a little girl whose mom wouldn't let her wear a Tiana dress.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1271459947335897089

YES!!!! This is it. Thank you!!! I spent like an hour trying to figure out where I saw it and was trying to change up my search to see if I could find it.

 

[disneysteve]

Has everyone heard of the term “Colorism”?

I saw a story the other day that some cosmetics manufacturers are dropping the terms "whitening" or "lightening" from their products.

https://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2020/06/26/business/26reuters-l-oreal-whitening.html

 

[AKL Ranger]

I'm learning a lot from this conversation and appreciate the tone of everyone sharing

Hi there @JiminyCricket!
Welcome to D.O.C.’s . I hope you will feel welcomed and will engage and share in this unique.The world of Disney from the viewpoint of People of Color and Allies of all colors.
Please feel free to ask questions.
As this is a new thread, start at page one and let me know what you think. Be sure to vote in the poll.

 

[AKL Ranger]

Was that in hopes of having lighter skinned offspring?

In part yes.

 

[Welsh_Dragon]

I saw that article a little while ago and was going to share it.

I have a friend who is a realtor in Florida who had posted a few weeks ago about the industry getting away from the term Master Bedroom so I was already aware of that. It is totally something that had never occurred to me as being problematic, but now I can't ever hear that term again without thinking that.

Honestly, I think a couple of things on that list might be a stretch, but the whole "black is bad; white is good" trope is so ingrained. We see it in books and movies over and over. Darth Vader, for example. Black magic. Lots of examples. So many terms are so far removed from their origin that 99.9% of people have no idea where the terms came from. I just learned this week about nitty gritty. I had no clue at all what that actually meant.

Master relates to so many things other than slavery. The Captain of a ship is called a Master, people read for ‘Master’s’ degrees, schools have Headmasters and Housemasters, Master builders, master craftsman etc. The list is endless. Young boys in the U.K. are still formally addressed as Master, irrespective of the colour of skin, rather than Mr. Surely master bedroom comes from a time when the patriarchal master and matriarchal mistress of a family and house, enjoyed their own bedrooms and they were the best in the house? Thank you for educating me about the other phrases.

 

[Welsh_Dragon]

Has everyone heard of the term “Colorism”?
Colorism, a term believed to be first coined in 1982 by Pulitzer Prize
winner Alice Walker, was defined by her to mean the “prejudicial or preferential treatment of same-race people based solely on their color.”

Has everyone heard of the “Paper Bag” test?
Yes Dis’ers such a thing has existed Surfing Slavery in the 1800’s lighter skinned slaves were given duties around the plantation owners house, while darker Colored Slaves were given hard manual field work.
The Paper bag test was something that still made it way into the 1940’ and early 50’s.
Applying for jobs in the 1940/50’s many black would describe as being “lighter Skinned color/tone”, as though it were ana career boost. The shame is yes, it was often the thing that sealed the deal as to who got hired.
Light skinned domestic workers, handy men were considered less of a threat. Among African American community Black men were encouraged to marry lighter skinned Black women.
Hence the brown paper bag test, if you were darker than a paper bag you were considered too dark.

https://www.thoughtco.com/what-is-colorism-2834952

I think colourism in literature far predates Alice Walker. What about Charles Chesnutt and The House Behind the Cedars?

 

[Welsh_Dragon]

In part yes.

It is interesting that in so many cultures and throughout history, pale skin was thought to be highly desirable in females in particular. I am thinking of the Ancient Egyptians and Romans and Far Eastern cultures, such as Chinese or Japanese, with geishas being an extreme example. Even in the U.K., before a ‘suntan’ became fashionable, the ‘fairer sex’ wished to be pale and winsome and avoided sunlight-think of the paintings of Elizabeth I. I think that was from a desire to be seen as ‘society’s elite’ rather than the working classes, so a prejudice based on class rather than race. Or perhaps it was both?
In the U.K. curled hair, particularly ringlets were thought of as desirable, rather than straight hair. My female cousins spent many sleepless nights with their hair in ‘rags’.