Enthusiastic about Genie+ touring

[JZCubed]

Easy. I’ve done it with MaxPass and old paper FP. I simply grab the pass a couple hours earlier.

Yes… I’m assuming it will operate somewhat close to how it’s supposed to operate.
For some reason, you’re assuming it won’t operate anything like it’s supposed to operate.

Your comment about nothing in life is certain indicates, once again, your desire to simply be disagreeable.

Simplistically, Disney World ‘reimbursed’ FP+ holders with options when weather and/or mechanical issues closed a ride. If you had an impacted FP, you were given another choice. But I digress…

Your notion of ride certainty is based on wishful thinking, at best.

If, as you say, Genie is ‘next available’ - seems as if you are the only person who knows what that will actually mean in a new, unlaunched, Genie+ program.

For instance - when we all log in at 7am, with no Parks yet open - what is the next available time that Haunted Mansion is going to be available on Genie+?

Will folks be able to select a time of their choice, or the next available time slot with openings provided by Genie+? Choice or Genie+?

You seem quite certain that you will miraculously (you said, “Easy”) select your choiced-3pm based on some skill set you learned with MaxPass; you’ve suggested that the next available time Genie+ offers will be your choiced-3pm, not some other time - because you learned how to game the MaxPass system.

That you have any certainty with your answer is reason enough to doubt anything you say, because as you keep reminding us - the product hasn’t actually launched. Moreover, Genie+ is being designed to further limit folks from being able to game a system.

Similarly, when booking for the individually priced Lightning Lane, Disney told us in writing that there will be a limited number of spaces for each time-slot (i.e., 1000 spaces at 7pm). If, let’s say the 1000 spaces at 7pm are booked, then what?

Regardless of your answer, if a time-slot can become full, then even with Lightening Lane, you get no time certainty until you have paid for a specific time-slot.

More specifically, if Rise of Resistance ‘sells out’ virtual queue in mere seconds, how high a price tag can you speculate before it fails to ‘sells out’ on any given day?

Further, if on-site guests can book Lightening Lane at 7am, what gives off-site guests any certainty that their time-slot of choice won’t be ‘sold out’ before their 9am booking window opens?

And a ‘sold out’ time-slot means zero ride certainty, even for people willing to pay….unless Disney can rig their own game by offering additional spaces in previously sold-out time-slots based on a willingness of folks to pay even more money. More succinctly, there is no guarantee that Rise of Resistance will have any noticeable availability for off-site guests.

That you have any degree of confidence regarding these nuanced matters based on your experience with MaxPass, shows how little you understand about the dynamics at Disney World and the potential for a self-serving rigged-bidding system [that has not yet launched].

Your confidence is based on speculation of how you hope the system should work, nothing more.

 

[havoc315]

Your comment about nothing in life is certain indicates, once again, your desire to simply be disagreeable.

Simplistically, Disney World ‘reimbursed’ FP+ holders with options when weather and/or mechanical issues closed a ride. If you had an impacted FP, you were given another choice. But I digress…

But if it’s pouring rain.. Safari still operates. You just might not want to go to AK in the pouring rain. If you oversleep and miss your Fastpass, Disney isn’t going to just give you a new FOP Fastpass.

Nothing is certain. But G+ is more certain than FP+.

Your further comments show you don’t understand how G+ works.

[QU
If, as you say, Genie is ‘next available’ - seems as if you are the only person who knows what that will actually mean in a new, unlaunched, Genie+ program.
If, as you say, Genie is ‘next available’ - seems as if you are the only person who knows what that will actually mean in a new, unlaunched, Genie+ program.

For instance - when we all log in at 7am, with no Parks yet open - what is the next available time that Haunted Mansion is going to be available on Genie+?


Will folks be able to select a time of their choice, or the next available time slot with openings provided by Genie+? Choice or Genie+?
[/QUOTE]

Anyone who has ever used MaxPass or paper FP can answer this for you. It’s not that complicated. If Magic Kingdom opens at 9am, then at 7am, you would get a 9am return time for Haunted Mansion. Through the day, return times will stay 30-120 minutes ahead, on average. G+ is giving you the chance to stand in the line virtually.

so you want certainty, I can be 100% certain that I can get a 9am Haunted Mansion G+, by clicking it as I get ready for the park.

You seem quite certain that you will miraculously (you said, “Easy”) select your choiced-3pm based on some skill set you learned with MaxPass; you’ve suggested that the next available time Genie+ offers will be your choiced-3pm, not some other time - because you learned how to game the MaxPass system.

huh????? It’s not “gaming” the system. It’s using it as intended. Seems you don’t understand how it works.
If I request a Soarin G+ between 1-2, the return time will be in the approximate time frame of 2-4. As it launches, we can map this out with more precision.
But this is how it works by design — you request a G+, you get a return time 30-120 minutes into the future. There may be a handful of attractions where this doesn’t apply, but it’s how it works at the vast majority of attractions. If the standby line is 20 minutes, your G+ return would be 30-40 minutes away. If the standby line is an hour, then your return time will be 1-2 hours away

That you have any certainty with your answer is reason enough to doubt anything you say, because as you keep reminding us - the product hasn’t actually launched.

But MaxPass has. And it’s 95% the same as MaxPass. So I can speak with 95% certainty

Moreover, Genie+ is being designed to further limit folks from being able to game a system.
That you have any certainty with your answer is reason enough to doubt anything you say, because as you keep reminding us - the product hasn’t actually launched. Moreover, Genie+ is being designed to further limit folks from being able to game a system.

Huh? Why would anyone need to “game” the system? You use the system as designed..

Similarly, when booking for the individually priced Lightning Lane, Disney told us in writing that there will be a limited number of spaces for each time-slot (i.e., 1000 spaces at 7pm). If, let’s say the 1000 spaces at 7pm are booked, then what?

Regardless of your answer, if a time-slot can become full, then even with Lightening Lane, you get no time certainty until you have paid for a specific time-slot.

Are you certain you can go to the supermarket and buy milk? What if every supermarket in your neighborhood runs out of milk?

You don’t understand dynamic pricing. The LL attractions will be priced to regulate demand. So there won’t be a mad rush of 20,000 people to purchase 1,000 slots. Sure, if you wait till 2pm to purchase, the 2:15pm time slot may already be sold out. But through the day, there will be lots of availability and options

And in case you didn’t notice, FP+ “ran out” too. I’ve never ever been able to get a FOP FP+. My trips were short, I did AK on my first 1-2 days at WDW. FOP was always “sold out” before my booking window opened.

Because demand is now being regulated by price, anyone willing to pay will actually have certainty

More specifically, if Rise of Resistance ‘sells out’ virtual queue in mere seconds, how high a price tag can you speculate before it fails to ‘sells out’ on any given day?

Further, if on-site guests can book Lightening Lane at 7am, what gives off-site guests any certainty that their time-slot of choice won’t be ‘sold out’ before their 9am booking window opens?

What gave off-site guests certainty that they would be able to get Mine Train and FOP fastpasses at 30 days?

Your confidence is based on speculation of how you hope the system should work, nothing more.

My confidence is based on actually understanding MaxPass and what Disney is offering.
Now, maybe Disney is lying. Maybe they say it will be $15 and it will actually be $5,000 per day. Maybe G+ will only be available for Small World and nothing else. Maybe they will sell only 1 LL slot per day and price it at $1 million.

But assuming Disney is basically telling the truth, then my confidence is well founded. Your criticisms betray a lack of understanding as to how old FP and MaxPass work.

Simply stated, MaxPass is far superior to FP+. Most people who have used both systems will agree. WDW is simply implementing MaxPass.

 

[Mrs~Incredible]

Actually, my understanding is that Genie+ can be booked by off-site at 7am.
Yes, off-site has some disadvantages. But Genie+ is FAR better for off-site than FP+. You are no longer at a 30 day booking window disadvantage. Genie+ treats onsite and offsite almost the same. The only difference is you can't purchase individual attractions until you tap in. But those will have pretty open availability.

So Genie+ for off-site guest at DHS:

At 7am, book Genie+ for 9am Runaway Train.
Arrive at Park at 9am, purchase 11am ROTR, purchase 1pm Slinky Dog.
9am -- Ride Runaway Train with no line, book Smuggler's Run for noon.
9:30-11am, Muppetvision, BATB, Frozen Singalong
11am -- ride ROTR LL. Redeem Smuggler's Run, Genie+. Book another Genie+ for TSM at 2pm
1pm -- Ride Slinky Dog LL. Standby Saucers. Then Genie+ lane for TSM. Book another Genie+ for TOT, 5pm redemption
After finishing Toy Story land, eat lunch, Maybe take a break for a couple of hours. At 5pm, redeem Genie+ for TOT. As lines go down in the evening, ride RNR by standby, repeat any rides you want...

There, you did every major attraction as an off-site guest without any significant lines, thanks to Genie+ and LL.

I actually whole heartedly disagree. Have you ever stayed off site? We do every year, and every year we ended up with FPs to all the e-tickets. And despite the minor planning to get those FPs, for us we felt we had a ton of flexibility in our day. Touring as your outline suggests is not for us. If our next trip this fall is not what we are hoping for, we won’t be back.

You can have your opinion, but my past experiences had been amazing with FP as an offsite guest.

 

[havoc315]

I actually whole heartedly disagree. Have you ever stayed off site? We do every year, and every year we ended up with FPs to all the e-tickets. And despite the minor planning to get those FPs, for us we felt we had a ton of flexibility in our day. Touring as your outline suggests is not for us. If our next trip this fall is not what we are hoping for, we won’t be back.

Doing any ride you want, whenever you want, isn’t for you?
To each their own.

 

[Jennasis]

OMG stop trying to convince people to love it/hate it. Who cares?? It has no bearing on YOUR trip either way. Let the OP love it, and OP just stop trying to convince others. Nobody is budging here. Nothing will change either way until this thing rolls out.

Lots of shouting into the void.

 

[mi*vida*loca]

I'm looking forward to using Genie+. We used Max Pass before at DL and it was FAR superior to FP+.

How do you feel about the IAS being mixed into the G+? I’ve never been to DL so this new system is new to me.

 

[nkereina]

In all fairness, if you listen to people on here they will swear up and down, on their grandmothers grave that FP+ did NOT increase standby time.

They would be wrong.

Does maxpass at DL increase/decrease standby times? Bc this is basically maxpass, with an added cost of LL. But at least maxpass included photos for that $10/per day.

MaxPass at DL works in tandem with their paper FP system, which was the same as the old paper FP system in WDW. Whatever impact to standby times this system causes is negligible.

My guess is that yes, fewer people will be using the Genie+ queue. But they'll want/need to move these lines faster than the old fp lines because people are now paying for this service. They'll want positive feedback from those who decide to purchase. Disney will no doubt change around their ratios on each ride to find their sweet spot of trying to satisfy the people paying and those in standby. I don't think we'll really know what standby wait times will be like until this rolls out. I have a feeling that for the most part, standby lines will have similar waits when there was fp.

They won't need to move it faster per se, because there will be fewer people to move through it, so by nature it will move faster. To your point, they no doubt have modeled projects of how many they think will purchase it, how many they know come through standby queues on a given day, and how many return times can be given out in an hour. I suspect standby times will be the same or better as they were with FP+.

Disney controls wait times by determining how many people to admit to a Park and how many people to staff at each ride/attraction.

According to CEO Chapek, only 70% of Disney hotels were available for occupancy; 30% of Disney hotels were unavailable this summer. By definition, even at a full 70%, Disney was not crowded this summer.

There were no FP+ this entire summer.

And yet, wait times were just short of an hour on almost every ride & attraction.

At best, folks were able to save time at Rope Drop for one ride/attraction, but crowds accumulated quickly. And if more people adopt Rope Drop strategy (since we'll all be awake at 7am), as well as, to get ahead of Genie - mornings will be worse.

Genie and/or Genie+ will do nothing to control wait times. But paying for Genie will lower Park & ride demand.

Posted wait times were often that during peak times, yes. Do we know the figures on actual wait times? You also have to take into account new attractions which naturally have a higher demand, staffing shortages, ride delays due to cleaning protocols, ride down times. All of those things drive wait times. There's always a lot of variables, but if you take a day in the future when Genie+ is live and everything is functioning as it should with no pandemic protocols and full staffing levels, theoretically the standby line should average less than it has in the past as it will be moving faster than it did in the past with FP+.

I would also argue that on-site hotel percentages are moot points. Look at the number of people here, Disney's biggest fan base, that have been choosing to stay off-site. Plus the number of people who stayed off-site in condos/AirBnBs because of pandemic precautions. Did you visit the parks this summer? They sure felt as busy as pre-pandemic times, so I think many would argue that the statement "Disney was not crowded the summer" is just false.

 

[Airb330]

Doing any ride you want, whenever you want, isn’t for you?
To each their own.

That’s how FP+ was for a lot of us

 

[havoc315]

That’s how FP+ was for a lot of us

So, under FP+… if I decide to do Animal Kingdom instead of Epcot when I wake up, I could grab a same day pass to FOP?

 

[Airb330]

So, under FP+… if I decide to do Animal Kingdom instead of Epcot when I wake up, I could grab a same day pass to FOP?

You sure could. No guarantees under either system…

 

[VandVsmama]

How do you feel about the IAS being mixed into the G+? I’ve never been to DL so this new system is new to me.

What is IAS?

 

[mi*vida*loca]

What is IAS?

the individual attraction selections that you pay per ride. ROTR, SDMT, etc.

 

[VandVsmama]

the individual attraction selections that you pay per ride. ROTR, SDMT, etc.

Max Pass let you select individual attractions and would display what the next1 hr return window is but there was not an additional fee beyond the initial $10-$20 you paid for the day for Max Pass. Also, you couldn’t use Max Pass until you had entered a park for the day.

 

[MATTERHORN]

THIS. I have two little kids (pre-school and a one year old). They are early risers in general, my whole LIFE is about being up at 5am. A huge benefit of Disney is that Disney KNOCKS KIDS OUT and we MIGHT get to sleep until 7am. I hate the idea of having to forego that for rope drop. And here's the other thing... even if you ARE up at 5am, getting to the parks by 8am with two little kids is still next to impossible. Add in the fact that now you'll basically have to choose between a character breakfast (which I have always loved) and riding your favorite ride....it blows. We are lucky enough that we get to do longer stays. So we will book Genie+ for say, half of our days, and book breakfasts and take it easy on the other days. But This element of the system is a big downside for me. I liked that we could take it easy in the mornings with FP+ and still know that we could get on some of our favorite at a time that worked best for us.

Do you character breakfast later like I do. Eat an easy breakfast/snack, do all the rides while shorter lines and do the 10:30 or 11am character breakfast and fill up!! Then you only need dinner later!

 

[MATTERHORN]

Max Pass let you select individual attractions and would display what the next1 hr return window is but there was not an additional fee beyond the initial $10-$20 you paid for the day for Max Pass. Also, you couldn’t use Max Pass until you had entered a park for the day.

I did love the fact that you couldn't book until you entered. Really made it a level playing field and that felt more fair to me. I haven't really read every detail, so you can book before park opening with Genie?

 

[MATTERHORN]

So, under FP+… if I decide to do Animal Kingdom instead of Epcot when I wake up, I could grab a same day pass to FOP?

Yeah, that pretty much never would have happened. The new system will be a thousand times better for changing plans!

 

[havoc315]

I did love the fact that you couldn't book until you entered. Really made it a level playing field and that felt more fair to me. I haven't really read every detail, so you can book before park opening with Genie?

You can start booking shortly before park opens, 7am. Thus, first return times will be right when park opens officially, just like FP+.

Since every park will have early entry, there will likely already be significant standby lines by official open.

 

[Disneylover99]

They won't need to move it faster per se, because there will be fewer people to move through it, so by nature it will move faster. To your point, they no doubt have modeled projects of how many they think will purchase it, how many they know come through standby queues on a given day, and how many return times can be given out in an hour. I suspect standby times will be the same or better as they were with FP+.

Time will tell. But you’ve also got DAS users, VIP tours, etc….also using these queues. And the bigger wave of people will probably be Genie+ recovery.

Rides go down often. They’ll likely offer anytime Genie+ ride recovery passes just as they did with fp’s. But with people now paying for this service, they’ll want to ensure these queues don’t get bunged up with people like fp lines did.

 

[dez1978]

That’s a bet I’m willing to take. Sure, might have to wait an hour. But I expect anyone will be able to ride Mine Train with purchase, with fairly wide open same day availability, certainly within 1-2 hours.

Nothing in life is certain. Rides break, storms cancel flights.

But I strongly suspect there will be more ride certainly than with FP+.

I’ll know I can book a LL/G+ at any time. That’s great certainly. So if my bus runs late, if I oversleep, I’m still certain I’ll get the ride I want.

My next trip is just a 2 day trip in February, President’s weekend. I am virtually certain I’ll be able to get FOP and Mine Train with LL.

Right now, if FP+ still existed, can you be certain that I’d be able to get FOP FP for my first morning and Mine Train FP for my first night?

Seems Genie+/LL is giving me far more advance certainty.



yes, that’s how LL will work.

G+ is next available. LL is purchase a specific time slot.

And WORST case scenario is 3 passes per day. Best case is 8-10 per day. Most likely, 4-5 per day.

I need to know how you are 100% certain without a doubt that you will be able to get every single ride you want at the exact time you want? Do you have some crystal ball none of the rest of us have? Because if the ride your kid 100% has their heart set on riding only has availability at 6 pm because you slept in, then you can't get another LL or selection until you've done that one ride, or checked in at least, because you can only get 1 at a time. And lets not pretend like this is not a very likely possibility. so do you get it and then can't get any other ones until then or do you not get it and take the chance of not riding it at all?

You are so absolutely certain that things will be just like you've outlined when literally nothing has said that will absolutely be the case. Yet with fp+ we were guaranteed 3 fp+/day worst case scenario, and anyone who knew you could get more than that got more like 6-7

 

[nkereina]

Time will tell. But you’ve also got DAS users, VIP tours, etc….also using these queues. And the bigger wave of people will probably be Genie+ recovery.

Rides go down often. They’ll likely offer anytime Genie+ ride recovery passes just as they did with fp’s. But with people now paying for this service, they’ll want to ensure these queues don’t get bunged up with people like fp lines did.

Even still, the number of people with Genie+ or one of the other LL users does not equate to the same number of people in the park as it did with FP+. You're also entering the queue at the next available time as opposed to a pre-scheduled time, so it will be a smaller number of people who are impacted if/when a ride goes down. I'm still of the opinion that standby times will average out to be lesser than they were with FP+, though it remains to be seen if that difference will be negligible or they'll end up being the same. I'm really of the opinion they will not be worse.

The guest recovery aspect will be interesting to see how it plays out. Value of Genie+ will be subjective. In the current state, you're SOL at DL if you don't feel like you got your money's worth out of MaxPass. Same for Universal with express pass.