Goodbye, Maxpass. Hello, Disney Genie.

[lcp9]

Wow I am super turned off by this. Like in a way that makes me think I'm not sure I want to go back. So, I can pay $60 extra for my family to ride RSR, OR I can force my 3 and 5 year old to stand in a 2 hour line. I would sooner have them jack up ticket prices but leave maxpass as it was so I feel like I can rides the rides my kids want to ride, not just the "cheap" ones.

 

[Epicnemesis]

It was always 90 minutes with Maxpass. 2 hours with regular FP.

I'm watching the video now. He says that "at launch," you'll have to add Genie+ to your Magic Key (or WDW AP) PER DAY, but they'll be "evaluating feedback" on that.

DO NOT LIKE THAT.

I interpret that as “we are going to see if we can milk the suckers daily, and if not we will make it a pass add on”

 

[kristensideaoffun]

It was 90 minutes with Maxpass, 2 hours with regular FP.

It could definitely be different. I do not know how DAS works, and perhaps this is modeled after that.

The language was the same with Maxpass, though. I explained the "one at a time" thing not REALLY being "one at at time" to soooo many people; it's the reason I created a whole Maxpass thread here.

I am guessing they'd use the structure of Maxpass because it already exists and was in the app, and to my non-tech-brain, repurposing that would be easiest way to go. But it's very possible the rules will be different.

They simultaneously announced a “revamp” of the old DAS system. People will now be able to sign up for a DAS in advance, and will be able to book rides directly within the app without visiting a kiosk. When I saw that, I thought they might be using the opportunity to merge the two systems.

 

[Epicnemesis]

They simultaneously announced a “revamp” of the old DAS system. People will now be able to sign up for a DAS in advance, and will be able to book rides directly within the app without visiting a kiosk. When I saw that, I thought they might be using the opportunity to merge the two systems.

If they do that they will find out a lot more people have “crowd anxiety”

 

[DisSurfer878]

If they do that they will find out a lot more people have “crowd anxiety”

Did you actually read how they will have them preregister? You have to schedule a live video call with a CM and explain your need to them. If anything it will be harder

 

[PirateBrigade]

NEVERMIND, I took a screenshot from the video. It does seem like G+ will require you to complete the experience before booking another G+ reservation:

I highlighted the text after the G+ selection was made.

 

[Skyegirl1999]

I interpret that as “we are going to see if we can milk the suckers daily, and if not we will make it a pass add on”

100%

They simultaneously announced a “revamp” of the old DAS system. People will now be able to sign up for a DAS in advance, and will be able to book rides directly within the app without visiting a kiosk. When I saw that, I thought they might be using the opportunity to merge the two systems.

Hmm, I just saw that. So... honest question. Won't this lead to a tremendous abuse of the DAS system? No more free FP option at all + removing most of the DAS use friction... I hope I'm incorrect, and I am genuinely happy for those who need the DAS system if it's easier to use, but that is a concerning combination in some respects.

 

[kristensideaoffun]

If they do that they will find out a lot more people have “crowd anxiety”

They already announced they are doing it. They are also leaving the old system in place. I am guessing certain needs will still have to see guest services for a DAS.

 

[Skyegirl1999]

NEVERMIND, I took a screenshot from the video. It does seem like G+ will require you to complete the experience before booking another G+ reservation:

I highlighted the text after the G+ selection was made.

View attachment 598088

Oh shoot. That would be... not useful.

Also the 15-minute video made it seem like it was going to work just like Maxpass, even down to asking the one Panelist about his Maxpass thoughts. If this is *that* different than Maxpass, then that's really misleading!

 

[lindyv321]

So he said 15 attractions will be included in Genie+… including HM, BTM, and Smugglers Run, anyone care to speculate which the others might be?

 

[lcp9]

I just paused on the Youtube video and it looks like space mountain is also for purchase. Give me a break.

 

[DisSurfer878]

So he said 15 attractions will be included in Genie+… including HM, BTM, and Smugglers Run, anyone care to speculate which the others might be?

But for WDW or Disneyland? Because there's some rides that are in both parks, but both don't have FPs

 

[MaleficentRN]

I have MP on tickets I bought last year. I wonder if they launch it before my trip if they'll let me grandfather it to this Genie thing?

 

[AndrewC]

Very very interesting. I know this will be crushing to a lot of families, I can't even imagine what it might be like if you have three kids and a spouse that all want to go on a "high demand" ride that might be $7/person, or $12, or whatever. BUT.... and this is a big but, with FastPass being sunset, this might make this new program extremely powerful. It was always talked about how FastPass and even Single rider to a limit slowed down the actual normal line. With FastPass being gone, we won't have a *HUGE* portion of people "passively waiting" and thus slowing down the normal lines.

If you have a capacity of 500/hr and 300 of that is showing up within that hour because they were fastpass, the people in line are going to move 60% slower (since you have 60% of your ride capacity "jumping" the line via FastPass). There is an upper limit to what people will wait, and this might actually spread the guests out more. Instead of a FastPass return for RSR being 7pm (even though it's only 11am) and the standby being 70 minutes, you might have a standby that's more like 40 minutes because the full ride's capacity is able to chew through the line as fast as possible. In addition, paying to jump the line might be less common, so the return time might not be 7pm but might instead be noon because only 100 people are paying to jump the line that hour instead of absolutely every available spot via FastPass being used up.

The fact is, this won't increase ride capacity. No sort of queuing system can do that. But what it might do is allow the people that are willing (and can afford to) pay to jump the line do so MUCH quicker, which will result in higher guest experiences for that service. At the same time it might allow what looks to be a very long line move a lot faster because much more of the ride capacity is being used to the people physically standing there. Finally the system is just going to try to nudge people away from all racing toward RSR at 9am to knock that out first because it's the most popular and try to shift that demand across the whole day. That... well, that'll be probably the least likely to work. If Indie or RSR is my #1 attraction, I'm going to ride that at all costs and not risk it going down later in the day before I have to go home, etc.

Again, I feel bad for families that suddenly will be priced out of some of these added services. There's no doubt that Disney just made it much more expensive to pack your day full of the specific stuff you want to do. Instead they're trying to get people to spread out around the park more and balance the lines, and chew through the lines as fast as possible.

I'm curious how accurate the displayed wait times will be. I wouldn't be surprised if Disney plays around with those numbers to "trick" guests into thinking the wait wasn't nearly as bad as it seemed, or to maybe skip that ride right now because the wait estimate is really high, when honestly it isn't that high, but the queue is starting to spill into walkways and it would really benefit the park to gently nudge customers away from joining it at that moment. The brain probably will go off how long the line visually seems, if RSR is so backed up you can't even SEE the attraction, people might be likely to walk away and come back later. But with more ride capacity going to clearing that standby line, it might still be the normal 70 minute wait (or even less). However, if your sign reads 60 to 70 minutes people probably will jump in line, spilling into walk ways even more. I suspect Disney will be lying to us a lot for "our own good."

We need some college students to do some research studies on this. See what the estimated wait time in the app shows, what the physical line shows, what the displayed wait time AT the line shows, and how long it actually takes to get on the ride. I bet they don't all add up but instead are adjusted to manipulate customers to what manages that demands of the park the most.

 

[PirateBrigade]

Oh shoot. That would be... not useful.

Also the 15-minute video made it seem like it was going to work just like Maxpass, even down to asking the one Panelist about his Maxpass thoughts. If this is *that* different than Maxpass, then that's really misleading!

Caveats I suppose: (1) it might have been for illustration only, so final wording/implementation might be different, but it doesn't bode well. (2) If everyone's limited, that might change the dynamic a bit and you might see a lot more available spots within the next 90mins-2hrs. (3) the example showed WDW, but the systems are going to be the same, I think.

So back to cost, if you can squeeze 3 rides out of this G+ -- that's like $7/ride. Then add LL at ~$15/ride. I'm going to be tuning in here intently to see what the real world behavior is for these products!

 

[CaliforniaGirl09]

Bummed but not surprised. This makes me wish they'd go back to the old ticket book option "virtually." They tried to do it with WDW tiered FP+ system but they didn't have enough rides at each park to make it work. It feels like it would work at Disneyland if you did day of (so not having to schedule way ahead of time).

 

[gelatoni fan]

Eager to find out if there's an add on for the Magic Key, and what kind of upcharge. I thought the $100 for my FlexPass was worth it. It would be nice to always have Photopass again.

They said that they have no plans to do this at launch but will explore it. Even though I would gladly pay for an annual subscription to photopass, $20 a day is not worth it to me.

Whether this is good or not for rides will really depend on how entry times are controlled. If you could consistently get entry times 5 minutes away when the line is 60 minutes, this could be a good deal. But if they severely limit entry times so that they are all hours away, then it's not. At least to me, it doesn't seem entirely like DAS which has wait times equal to the posted wait time for standby.

When compared to Maxpass, you lose the ability to stack rides. So in the past, you could put a bunch of E ticket pastpasses together at night but now you can't. It's also not clear how they handle Multiple Experiences. In the past, you could strategically grab fastpasses with no intention to ride the ride and gain a fastpass to use at a ride that you actually want that's usable at any time of the day.

We all expected paid fastpass so Lightning Lanes is no surprise.

If they had this rather than Fastpass+ in the past, I would have probably gone to WDW a few times the past few years. But Disney has done such a great job at frustrating me the past couple of years that I don't even want to anymore.

An interesting thing that hasn't been discussed much is free Disney Genie. I suspect that this will recommend people to less popular attractions and smooth out wait times throughout the day. I doubt I would follow their recommendations much but being able to see predicted wait times can be pretty major.

 

[PirateBrigade]

Other random thoughts:

1) The TouringPlans, I mean, Disney Genie day planning system -- I wonder if it can outperform a) TouringPlans or b) park knowledge in terms of # of rides ridden. I think we need like, a scientific experiment where three people vie to ride a whole list of attractions and see who comes out ahead (not using any G+ or LL). Volunteers, please!

2) Why does WDW get augmented reality and DLR doesn't? It's literally.... fake pictures on a phone. Is it bad that I'm cynical and am thinking to myself, "well, this is one way to cut back on character experiences... just have them be AI augmented reality characters." Blah.

3) It's going to be a mad rush of people on their phones in the mornings -- 7am BG for ROTR, 7:30am (if 8am gate opening) rush to tag into the parks so you can purchase G+/LL, setting your Disney Genie agenda (maybe), getting mobile food orders placed. If you guys don't upgrade your phones often, it's probably a good time to do so.

 

[PirateBrigade]

An interesting thing that hasn't been discussed much is free Disney Genie. I suspect that this will recommend people to less popular attractions and smooth out wait times throughout the day. I doubt I would follow their recommendations much but being able to see predicted wait times can be pretty major.

I view any attempt to guide my day from Disney to be suspect, given how wacky some of their wait times are. There is also that theory that they inflate wait times to push people to other places in the park.

I'm willing to try this TouringPlans copy cat, but I want to see hard data on whether the Disney algorithm can beat TP or even detailed park/crowd experience.

 

[Epicnemesis]

It's also not clear how they handle Multiple Experiences. In the past, you could strategically grab fastpasses with no intention to ride the ride and gain a fastpass to use at a ride that you actually want that's usable at any time of the day.

I thought I was so smart, today I learned I was playing checkers with max pass while you were playing chess.