Hypothetical Legal Question-Jambo House

[WilsonFlyer]

As a AKK owner, I'm very intrigued with the legal questions surrounding the apparent displacement of DVC guests at Jambo House and those reservations being transferred to Kidani (and possibly other places).

I understand Disney's "right" to take rooms out of service for maintenance, but then putting them to private use and superseding a reservation made by an owner seems ludicrous to me. Is this legal? I know we don't know the full details yet, but all of us can read between the lines. They are, apparently; going to put mls or the nba (lower case intentional in both cases because neither one is significant enough to me to deserve upper case) players in here. If that is indeed what happens, what are the legal implications of doing so?

These owners made these reservation while being fully entitled to the same. "Well we don't want you to stay there so here, take this instead." is not the way I thought timeshare ownership worked. Had Disney used their points to reserve these rooms fair and square, I'd probably have issue with that, but I could at least understand the legality of it.

So does the guy that owns 4000 points get to boot me out of a room if he wants it? How exactly does that work?

I get the hotel component, but we're not talking about that here. You want a bubble? Go use a property without a DVC component. Not good enough for those guests? Then go somewhere else. I don't recall any nba players stepping up to pay for my DVC or my dues.

I know this is getting discussed in other places intermittently, but I think it deserves a thread of its own right. This really seems to be crossing definitively over some mighty black lines. No gray area for me. Somebody explain to me what I'm missing.

 

[Sandisw]

I think there are two different situations that could be treated differently here...initial timing with AKL closed, and if they open up AKL to other guests...whether it be NBA, MLS , or simply those staying on cash.

First, and not being an AKV owner, is it considered one resort, with one condo association, just with 2 buildings?

It seems as it is as owners are giving 11 month priority at both, Assuming it is, then being inside a closed resort, should be legal justification to take them out of service...as long as they are considered to be part of a larger DVC association...think Congress Park being shut down for renovations...one section, but part of larger resort,

With CL being suspended, those rooms are already out of service. But, between June 22nd and the opening of AKL, i think they can close and move.

Now, completely different picture, IMO, if they open up the resort building, Then I think it would be a questionable move for them to not allow those who are currently booked remain, regardless who is there,

Given all the points they own, them snatching up all current availability is legal...since we are within 7 months every point is valid and they do not have to abide by the same booking window and time as the rest of us.

However, what I do not think they can do..other than CL if that service remains suspended, is kick out DVC from booked rooms if they are opening up the other rooms,

So, right now, I think they can but once they decide to open up their portion of the hotel, it becomes legally shaky...at least in my book.

I think the only reason they had to open CCV in WL, even though that is hotel is closed, is because CCV is its own association. I don’t believe that Jambo is...I think Kidani and Jambo are part of one DVC resort.

 

[WilsonFlyer]

Congress Park was actually taken out of service for renovations. That is part and parcel of our agreement. Taking my room only to give it to someone else is not. That's my argument.

 

[Doingitagain]

To me it really depends on if Jambo is closed or is being used for a private party. If it is closed and they can move the guests to Kidani, it seems to be a reasonable cost accommodation and will result in lower dues for owners next year when they adjust (which is what they said they would do). If they use it for a private party, I do not think it is ethical to remove previously booked DVC reservations without some sort of accommodation to those owners.

It very well may be that Jambo is only closed until they can no longer accommodate all of DVC at KIdani, and/or they open deluxe resorts. That may be when the parks open July 11. We have to be patient and see what happens since there is a lot in flux, including how many will cancel reservations. I am glad they stopped new reservations while they sorted this out.

 

[Sandisw]

Congress Park was actually taken out of service for renovations. That is part and parcel of our agreement. Taking my room only to give it to someone else is not. That's my argument.

That is why I said that there are two different situations at play. If Disney does not open the building at all and Jambo and Kidani are one association, then they can keep those rooms out of service,

But, if they open the resort for any stays, then no, I do not believe they move someone who booked because then there is not a legal reason because the building has reopened.

 

[OKW Lover]

I think the OP has a valid point.

I don't think Disney could claim they are taking them out of service for maintenance/renovations under these circumstances. Especially if they then use those units for non DVC (ie the NBA) purposes.

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

I've been trying to figure it out too. Certainly not for the situation you describe - that would be out of contract. I'm also just trying to figure out if they are ignoring the POS just by having Jambo DVC closed. I hope it's just the initial couple weeks so I can stop thinking that they are ignoring the POS to suit Disney and Disney resorts vs what they are legally obligated to for DVC.

 

[StitchesGr8Fan]

Did they say they were taking them out if service for renovations? Or that it wouldn’t be open?

 

[WilsonFlyer]

I've been trying to figure it out too. Certainly not for the situation you describe - that would be out of contract. I'm also just trying to figure out if they are ignoring the POS just by having Jambo DVC closed. I hope it's just the initial couple weeks so I can stop thinking that they are ignoring the POS to suit Disney and Disney resorts vs what they are legally obligated to for DVC.

They can call it whatever they want (closed). If they are using the DVC component with displaced members for closed hotel bubble purposes, we have a problem IMO.

 

[WilsonFlyer]

The problem is that mls and the nba are demanding deluxe accommodations I suspect and once again, Disney has overloaded their hindparts and over promised. If you think about it, Coronado and AKL are probably the only two big enough to create that "bubble" they keep talking about. I could easily argue CBR, but we all know they're too good to stay there. I'm surprised they would lower themselves to CS, but that's sort of my whole point.

Disney's talked the big talk and now their bluff's been called and they have to belly-up-to-the-bar. It's fine if they want to appear as the savior to major league sports in the media, but when it starts happening at the expense of people that actually own the property, we have a problem.

 

[heynowirv]

Am I missing anything? When the agreement was announced it was for Wide World Of Sports Complex and Coronado Springs . Is that no longer the case?

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

The problem is that mls and the nba are demanding deluxe accommodations I suspect and once again, Disney has overloaded their hindparts and over promised. If you think about it, Coronado and AKL are probably the only two big enough to create that "bubble" they keep talking about. I could easily argue CBR, but we all know they're too good to stay there. I'm surprised they would lower themselves to CS, but that's sort of my whole point.

Disney's talked the big talk and now their bluff's been called and they have to belly-up-to-the-bar. It's fine if they want to appear as the savior to major league sports in the media, but when it starts happening at the expense of people that actually own the property, we have a problem.

CS has the new tower.

 

[chicagoshannon]

I thought they had to legally accomadate the points they've sold. I don't think they can just close it down willy nilly.

For example I have a studio booked for December. There is no room at Kidani for them to move me to. What happens then? They seem to have blocked off Jambo til the end of the year.

I do want to add that I've now seen one report that they did in fact get a room in Jambo for July 17. They had called to reschedule their early July trip and at first were given SSR but then waitlisted Jambo which came through today.

 

[Sandisw]

I thought they had to legally accomadate the points they've sold. I don't think they can just close it down willy nilly.

For example I have a studio booked for December. There is no room at Kidani for them to move me to. What happens then? They seem to have blocked off Jambo til the end of the year.

I do want to add that I've now seen one report that they did in fact get a room in Jambo for July 17. They had called to reschedule their early July trip and at first were given SSR but then waitlisted Jambo which came through today.

They have plenty of points to have blocked off the rooms and still be considered legal. That is not an issue,

The issue will be for any owner or guest who is booked on points during a time when the resort is open for guests..again, doesn’t matter if those guests are NBA, MLS, or cash guests,

As soon as Disney deems Jambo safe to open, then any DVC owner should not lose their room..unless it is CL and CL is still not be delivered to any guests at WDW.

Kicking someone out of a DVC room when other rooms in the hotel are being used, is where they would run into legal trouble with the POS.

So, right now, IMO, they are legally okay not to have opened it June 22nd, because of Kidani since AKL, the hotel, is closed.

I say that because they did not close CCV at WL, even though those were in a closed hotel.

 

[chicagoshannon]

They have plenty of points to have blocked off the rooms and still be considered legal. That is not an issue,

The issue will be for any owner or guest who is booked on points during a time when the resort is open for guests..again, doesn’t matter if those guests are NBA, MLS, or cash guests,

As soon as Disney deems Jambo safe to open, then any DVC owner should not lose their room..unless it is CL and CL is still not be delivered to any guests at WDW.

Kicking someone out of a DVC room when other rooms in the hotel are being used, is where they would run into legal trouble with the POS.

So, right now, IMO, they are legally okay not to have opened it June 22nd, because of Kidani since AKL, the hotel, is closed.

I say that because they did not close CCV at WL, even though those were in a closed hotel.

I don't know. I own my points at Jambo. It literally says that on my deed. Yes I can book at either or but my points are Jambo.

I honestly care less about his than that SAB is closed but find it an interesting legal question.

 

[Sandisw]

I don't know. I own my points at Jambo. It literally says that on my deed. Yes I can book at either or but my points are Jambo.

I honestly care less about his than that SAB is closed but find it an interesting legal question.

I am deeded into specific buildings at SSR but it is still one resort.

If AKV is one condo association that consists of Kidani and Jambo, which appears to be true with the 11 month home resort rules, then I do think it is why they can keep it closed as long as Kidani is open.

But, you are right, the rest of it is messy and to be honest, I don’t see Disney messing with DVC for NBA or other sports teams when they have other places to use,

Yeah, I know people are upset about SAB. I have reached out to a few sources I have to see if I can get any info on if it will remain closed once BC and YC open.

 

[chicagoshannon]

I am deeded into specific buildings at SSR but it is still one resort.

If AKV is one condo association that consists of Kidani and Jambo, which appears to be true with the 11 month home resort rules, then I do think it is why they can keep it closed as long as Kidani is open.

But, you are right, the rest of it is messy and to be honest, I don’t see Disney messing with DVC for NBA or other sports teams when they have other places to use,

Yeah, I know people are upset about SAB. I have reached out to a few sources I have to see if I can get any info on if it will remain closed once BC and YC open.

I didn't realize SSR was deeded to certain buildings but that makes sense since I"m sure they opened one building at a time.

I'm really hoping SAB opens by our September trip (yes I'm being selfish). We've waited years to stay here. But just my luck a hurricane will come through and it will be closed anyway. lol

 

[Sandisw]

I didn't realize SSR was deeded to certain buildings but that makes sense since I"m sure they opened one building at a time.

I'm really hoping SAB opens by our September trip (yes I'm being selfish). We've waited years to stay here. But just my luck a hurricane will come through and it will be closed anyway. lol

Everyone is deeded to a specific unit, So, any resort that has more than one, will be that way...it has nothing to do when it was open,

It is like when they added the THV...they made them part of the existing SSR resort, but some owners deeds are there.

I actually think you may have a good shot at that because capacity will be raised,

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

They have plenty of points to have blocked off the rooms and still be considered legal. That is not an issue,

The issue will be for any owner or guest who is booked on points during a time when the resort is open for guests..again, doesn’t matter if those guests are NBA, MLS, or cash guests,

As soon as Disney deems Jambo safe to open, then any DVC owner should not lose their room..unless it is CL and CL is still not be delivered to any guests at WDW.

Kicking someone out of a DVC room when other rooms in the hotel are being used, is where they would run into legal trouble with the POS.

So, right now, IMO, they are legally okay not to have opened it June 22nd, because of Kidani since AKL, the hotel, is closed.

I say that because they did not close CCV at WL, even though those were in a closed hotel.

I think it's safe to say this is not a safety issue with Jambo.

 

[Sandisw]

I think it's safe to say this is not a safety issue with Jambo.

Right now, they can claim that reducing capacity of resort guests fits into the phased opening plan, which is why they didn’t open up their esorts at once.

Like I said, IMO, since it appears Kidani and Jambo are part of one DVC resort, them opening one and not both doesn’t seem to me to be a violation.

For all we know, at SSR or OKW, they may keep some buildings closed and consolidate. I see this as the same thing for this initial phase.