Unfair in the workplace

[Cannot_Wait_4Disney]

If you’re drunk and call off from work no problem take your pto.

If you don’t feel like coming into work and call off no problem take your pto.

Your pet is sick and you call off and you take them to the vets and my work finds out- no pay plus points after so many points is disciplinary actions

Your pet dies and you call off from work and they find out no pay plus points.


Your thoughts?

Every place I've been involved in, including my own would fire you if they found out you called in drunk.

 

[FreeTime]

Sounds like there is more to the policy that isn’t being mentioned. I have worked for a large corporation, the government and myself. Each one treated it different. But both the government agency I was at and the corporation had designated sick days. If you called off sick, fine. Three or more days, needed a doctors note. For a pet passing, overflowing toilet, car broken down, etc. you would use a personal day. Problems would arise once people burned through them and then they would complain that others are calling off due to X and aren’t in trouble.

 

[dclpluto]

Sounds like there is more to the policy that isn’t being mentioned. I have worked for a large corporation, the government and myself. Each one treated it different. But both the government agency I was at and the corporation had designated sick days. If you called off sick, fine. Three or more days, needed a doctors note. For a pet passing, overflowing toilet, car broken down, etc. you would use a personal day. Problems would arise once people burned through them and then they would complain that others are calling off due to X and aren’t in trouble.

There isn’t more to the policy. We get five state mandatory pto days. We have no personnel days. We can’t use our vacation days to call out.

 

[ronandannette]

There isn’t more to the policy. We get five state mandatory pto days. We have no personnel days. We can’t use our vacation days to call out.

Why not? That's what has to happen at my workplace, if an absence doesn't fit into the rules for sick days. They are for personal illness or personal medical appointments only. No family needs or pet care. We don't have any unspecified personal days so vacation must be used for those instances. I try to cut my staff a fair bit of slack; I'd definitely give ONE grace day if someone's pet died. But a situation where a pet needed on-going care resulting in a bunch of lost time? No.

 

[TheIncredibles!]

If you’re drunk and call off from work no problem take your pto.

If you don’t feel like coming into work and call off no problem take your pto.

Your pet is sick and you call off and you take them to the vets and my work finds out- no pay plus points after so many points is disciplinary actions

Your pet dies and you call off from work and they find out no pay plus points.


Your thoughts?

Not enough details. What does “call off” mean? is there a policy stating acceptable reasons for “calling off”?

 

[Allison]

So, there is more to the story. People are calling in sick and others are weighing in on why they think they called in sick. Furthermore, sick days can't be used for pets and you are feeling salty about it.

 

[disneychrista]

So, there is more to the story. People are calling in sick and others are weighing in on why they think they called in sick. Furthermore, sick days can't be used for pets and you are feeling salty about it.

We have a very liberal sick policy. We can use our sick days for self, children, adult children, parents, grandparents, stepparents for appointments, sick but we too can not sue them for sick pets.

 

[Jennasis]

Quite happy to be self employed and not beholden to "write ups" or "points" like I'm a school kid who did a no no. If I need time off I take it...without pay of course.

 

[Lord Manhammer]

Every place I've been involved in, including my own would fire you if they found out you called in drunk.

I suppose it's better to call in drunk than come in drunk.

 

[Karin1984]

There isn’t more to the policy. We get five state mandatory pto days. We have no personnel days. We can’t use our vacation days to call out.

If the company dictates how you can or cannot spend your days off, it is time to start looking for another job.

 

[bakerworld]

If you’re drunk and call off from work no problem take your pto.

If you don’t feel like coming into work and call off no problem take your pto.

Your pet is sick and you call off and you take them to the vets and my work finds out- no pay plus points after so many points is disciplinary actions

Your pet dies and you call off from work and they find out no pay plus points.


Your thoughts?

Pretty sure it is not legal to ask for a reason for absence, especially with PTO. If the absence is longer than 3 days most employers can ask for a doctor note before being allowed to return to work. Now if time is segregated into vacation, sick, bereavement or personal employers are allowed to ask which the time off should be designated.

I can't remember the entity to report an employer for a human resource violation - google it. They deserve a wrist slap.

 

[john7994]

To my understanding, there are no federal laws prohibiting employers from asking employees the reason for using a PTO/Sick day. In general, employees do not need to disclose the nature/extent of the illness/injury or any medical details unless they choose to do so. However, employers are allowed to understand the expected duration. So if you are sick, you only need to disclose you are ill. State laws vary, as do employer practices, or whether the employee belongs to a bargaining unit/organization (such as a Union - whereby other employee protections may be afforded)

My Employer's policy encourages managers not to ask for specifics related to a sick day being requested, in so far as sick days are available to be taken by the employee. At the same time, especially since most states are considered in some level of at-will work states, employees can be terminated for anything that isn't legally protected like FMLA / ADA or discriminatory in nature. So using a sick day inappropriately from stated employer policies - could lead to termination - if the employer feels this is necessary.

 

[bcla]

Pretty sure it is not legal to ask for a reason for absence, especially with PTO. If the absence is longer than 3 days most employers can ask for a doctor note before being allowed to return to work. Now if time is segregated into vacation, sick, bereavement or personal employers are allowed to ask which the time off should be designated.

I can't remember the entity to report an employer for a human resource violation - google it. They deserve a wrist slap.

Depends on state law. There should be a company policy, and it could very well restrict the use of PTO for certain purposes. However, most employers I worked with considered PTO to be chosen at the discretion of the employee, subject to business needs. I can't imagine a company with a policy that singles out what the OP stated.

https://www.shrm.org/resourcesandtools/tools-and-samples/hr-qa/pages/requiring-pto-use.aspx​

Is it legal for employers to restrict the use of PTO?​

​

Employers are cautioned against unduly restricting the use of leave; if an employer offers the benefit of paid time off, employees should have a reasonable opportunity to take advantage of the benefit. Employers restricting the use of PTO or forcing employees to use PTO should check state legal requirements prior to implementing such a policy.​

 

[john7994]

Depends on state law. There should be a company policy, and it could very well restrict the use of PTO for certain purposes. However, most employers I worked with considered PTO to be chosen at the discretion of the employee, subject to business needs. I can't imagine a company with a policy that singles out what the OP stated.

https://www.shrm.org/resourcesandtools/tools-and-samples/hr-qa/pages/requiring-pto-use.aspx​

Is it legal for employers to restrict the use of PTO?​

​

Employers are cautioned against unduly restricting the use of leave; if an employer offers the benefit of paid time off, employees should have a reasonable opportunity to take advantage of the benefit. Employers restricting the use of PTO or forcing employees to use PTO should check state legal requirements prior to implementing such a policy.​

Your article requires a sign-in - at least for me...

 

[bcla]

To my understanding, there are no federal laws prohibiting employers from asking employees the reason for using a PTO/Sick day. In general, employees do not need to disclose the nature/extent of the illness/injury or any medical details unless they choose to do so. However, employers are allowed to understand the expected duration. So if you are sick, you only need to disclose you are ill. State laws vary, as do employer practices, or whether the employee belongs to a bargaining unit/organization (such as a Union - whereby other employee protections may be afforded)

My Employer's policy encourages managers not to ask for specifics related to a sick day being requested, in so far as sick days are available to be taken by the employee. At the same time, especially since most states are considered in some level of at-will work states, employees can be terminated for anything that isn't legally protected like FMLA / ADA or discriminatory in nature. So using a sick day inappropriately from stated employer policies - could lead to termination - if the employer feels this is necessary.

I think the OP wasn't mentioning a sick day per se but using what would traditionally be considered vacation time where the employer apparently had standards for it and punishment for not disclosing it was for a pet's death. But that would just be stupid. Vacation time is vacation time. Over the years (and through several employers) I've taken it for everything from trivial reasons, actual vacations, going to a baseball game, etc. I've told my manager why I was going and once I ended up eating that vacation because I was needed in the office, but that was my choice to tell. If I just said I needed a "personal day" off I don't see why that would be anything where the employer should care if it's because I'm trying to get over a deceased pet or just because I want to take a day with my kid.

In my experience, sick time could be taken hourly and could be applied several things. I used an entire day once when my wife was getting surgery and I needed to provide transportation. But at least in my state one valid reason is for a medical visit of any kind. I typically would volunteer the reason, but I wasn't specifically required to say other than I needed it. I mean - I'd think there are some embarrassing things one might not want to tell an employer such as a visit to a psychiatrist.

 

[john7994]

I think the OP wasn't mentioning a sick day per se but using what would traditionally be considered vacation time where the employer apparently had standards for it and punishment for not disclosing it was for a pet's death. But that would just be stupid. Vacation time is vacation time. Over the years (and through several employers) I've taken it for everything from trivial reasons, actual vacations, going to a baseball game, etc. I've told my manager why I was going and once I ended up eating that vacation because I was needed in the office, but that was my choice to tell. If I just said I needed a "personal day" off I don't see why that would be anything where the employer should care if it's because I'm trying to get over a deceased pet or just because I want to take a day with my kid.

In my experience, sick time could be taken hourly and could be applied several things. I used an entire day once when my wife was getting surgery and I needed to provide transportation. But at least in my state one valid reason is for a medical visit of any kind. I typically would volunteer the reason, but I wasn't specifically required to say other than I needed it. I mean - I'd think there are some embarrassing things one might not want to tell an employer such as a visit to a psychiatrist.

I wasn't responding to the OP - the conversation migrated (including who you also directly responded to) with the following statement:

"Pretty sure it is not legal to ask for a reason for absence, especially with PTO."

As originally posted:

Pretty sure it is not legal to ask for a reason for absence, especially with PTO. If the absence is longer than 3 days most employers can ask for a doctor note before being allowed to return to work. Now if time is segregated into vacation, sick, bereavement or personal employers are allowed to ask which the time off should be designated.

I can't remember the entity to report an employer for a human resource violation - google it. They deserve a wrist slap.

 

[bcla]

Your article requires a sign-in - at least for me...

I'm seeing it now, but I'm not sure why. I've seen similar articles (through basic searches) from the Society for Human Resource Management and this is the first time I've heard of a login being required. I was reading it just fine a few minutes ago.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Pretty sure it is not legal to ask for a reason for absence, especially with PTO. If the absence is longer than 3 days most employers can ask for a doctor note before being allowed to return to work. Now if time is segregated into vacation, sick, bereavement or personal employers are allowed to ask which the time off should be designated.

I can't remember the entity to report an employer for a human resource violation - google it. They deserve a wrist slap.

Where I worked sick time didn't exist. Even my husband's old company went away from separated sick and vacation and lumped it into PTO. Now he still had an old bank of sick time but it very rarely could be used and was more restricted than it was before it merged.

Doctor's notes also weren't a thing with my company. I had bronchitis and was out for days and my company's policy was a doctor's note was never a document that could be used because again it was don't ask don't tell. It was all based on was the time available or not in the system.

Company policy included bereavement leave although they could ask for proof.

Just understand not all companies operate like you are describing

 

[GreatLakes]

I get very few last minute PTO call offs from my staff. I might get "I need to work from home today" emails in the morning but I can't remember the last time I got a PTO that wasn't at least a day in advance. We don't have any different buckets, all PTO is just PTO with the exception of bereavement. FMLA is also handled through whatever the law states but if it comes to that it goes to HR.

I don't care why people put in PTO, it isn't any of my business. If there is a milestone date for a project and a key member puts in PTO I may try to determine how necessary it is but would never ask directly and that is an exception. Most people will know those dates weeks or months in advance and unless they are unmovable I always get the key staff's input on dates beforehand to avoid that exact scenario.

 

[china mom]

As every employer, state and country can be different, it is hard to tell from the information provided if this was unfair or not.

I have work in some form of public safety all my life and we could never "just call out" and use last minute leave for anything other than sickness of self or immediate family (not to include pets) Keep in mind hat if you called out sick, often someone else had to stay over and work a double. Vacation has always been a separate pot of leave and could only be taken with advanced notice. My most recent employer's policy was that you had to request your leave by the 15th of the month preceding the month in which you wanted leave. And it wasn't grunted that it would be granted.

Depending on staffing and position, yes, there was leeway for last minute leave for non illness but that was not the policy.

I am totally extrapolating but my assumption of the original post is that none of the reasons were valid excuses but he other employees just didn't get caught. I guessing that the OP mentioned her reason for taking off to someone and that someone snitched, hence the discipline.