Why did Disney not bundle in the tax and parking?

[SL6827]

Why did Disney separate that tax and parkings fees at the new tower? We're they made too? Or to possibly not to have to advertise a $11-12 dues price point?

 

[Sandisw]

I wonder because it is so high, they didn’t want the higher MFs…and maybe they figure many VDH buyers will trade out some of the time, and others trading in, which means those staying absorb it and not just owners..

Easy for VGC as it is something like .51/pt…$2.7/pt is much harder to absorb in the same way

 

[intamin]

Why did Disney separate that tax and parkings fees at the new tower? We're they made too? Or to possibly not to have to advertise a $11-12 dues price point?

Probably so that the tax is not forced on the owners of the resort but on the people who stay there.. which I get.. but yikes..

 

[Pens Fan]

I have no clue but I think it's more fair that they didn't. Considering the high cost of the tax, I think it's more appropriate to charge whoever actually stays there, vs the owner. If a VDH owner decides to use their points at WDW why should they have to pay for parking and transient tax at VDH? The possible parking fees (not confirmed ???) and tax stink, but personally I think DVC got it right by having that paid by the folks actually staying there.

 

[Epcot Forever Forever]

We have absolutely no idea what the plan for parking is yet. None.

 

[DisVDS]

The question is not why did they not bundle the tax and parking, but why is tax (and maybe parking) so damn high for staying in a timeshare? It is out of whack with all other examples of timeshares in Anaheim including VGC.

 

[CP3uhoh]

Already been touched on but if you use the points elsewhere you won’t pay the taxes per point so anyone who used their DLH points elsewhere ends up paying the tax anyway if they role it in. My impression is parking has not been decided.

Probably worth noting that trading INTO DLH, you’re paying those taxes too. 100 BWV points for a studio, $273 please. Interesting to see if people care and the reduces a rush at 7 months.

Big winners obviously are GCV owners, due for a refresh soon too, back to $300 on resale real quick. (Don’t own there sadly )

 

[supersnoop]

Probably to keep the parking lot separate from the association. We're seeing trends in the market towards less parking - the idea that in the near future your car may be able to drive itself to a remote parking lot, or more people using transit options. I imagine Disney wants to be able to redevelop adjacent land rather than legal obligate it to parking for the next 50 years.

 

[RoseGold]

It's clever because it makes the 40% OFF math work even better. When those things are rolled into dues, they make the room more expensive, and the make DVC more expensive compared to the cash room, which they could price rack rate with no parking and no taxes.

Same reason they put in the tower studios.

I'd love to see the math at the pitch. It's going to be rack rate at the new hotel, which they have sold at, and then a tower studio. No parking, no taxes.

I bet they'd do this in FL if they could, but the taxes aren't structured like this, they're property taxes and such.

I thought the parking lot does belong to the property? Maybe it doesn't even belong to DVC? That's interesting... I doubt Florida would allow that, I'm surprised if CA did.

 

[RoseGold]

Taking out taxes and parking makes this more appealing as SAP, if you want direct points, but also don't like the restrictions. No one will care about the DL restrictions, and I would much rather be selling these than RIV down the road. I think VDL is a good direct buy, even if you never plan to use it in CA.

Using the math from this table, which has many shortcomings,
https://www.dvcresalemarket.com/blog/best-economical-dvc-resorts-to-purchase-fall-2022/

this makes VDH points 4.6 in buy in, 9.06 in dues, total 13.66. This is middle of the pack on the chart, which is great IMO.

 

[DVChris]

https://spectrumnews1.com/ca/la-wes...passed--now-the-hard-part--collecting-the-tax

https://spectrumnews1.com/ca/la-wes...ected-hotel-tax-from-online-travel-companies-

From the 2nd article: “… many cities such as Anaheim have been changing the definitions of their tax code to include online travel agencies and wholesale companies such as Southwest, Disney and others that book all-in-one inclusive deals as operators.”

With this new law passing last Fall (maybe after our 2023 dues were calculated so may not have been a consideration at the time?), I am curious to know what others think whether DVC is considered a wholesale hotel room seller? I’m not a lawyer but to me VGC does not seem like an all-in-one inclusive deal type of stay. If we are not, then seems like our dues will not change much from past years?

 

[DonMacGregor]

I thought the parking lot does belong to the property? Maybe it doesn't even belong to DVC? That's interesting... I doubt Florida would allow that, I'm surprised if CA did.

The issue is that they aren't building any new parking capacity. Everything available to the new tower is already existing hotel parking. Unless the DLH wants to cede some of their own parking lots to DVC, then the DVC tower will need to use the hotel's parking lots...and pay for the use.

 

[AnnaKristoff2013]

I have no clue but I think it's more fair that they didn't. Considering the high cost of the tax, I think it's more appropriate to charge whoever actually stays there, vs the owner. If a VDH owner decides to use their points at WDW why should they have to pay for parking and transient tax at VDH? The possible parking fees (not confirmed ???) and tax stink, but personally I think DVC got it right by having that paid by the folks actually staying there.

Parking fees are bundled into the DVC costs at WDW though. So a person at the new tower who trades into WDW gets the benefit of the parking without having to pay for parking on their own accommodation. A person at WDW trading into the new tower pays the parking twice. Seems unfair and a way for DVC to try to pass more costs onto existing owners to keep the fees for the new buyers artificially low.

 

[Matty B13]

I also don't like the way that DVC has been changing the way new resorts have been added into the "Club". RIV and VDH with the new restrictions and the fees at VDH. Seems that they should be an added cost for them to trade into the Original 14 since none of these resorts have any restrictions.

Why should an Owner at VGF pay for the parking and taxes for a VDH owner who trades in, and then have to pay the same fees when using at VDH????

 

[Sandisw]

Parking fees are bundled into the DVC costs at WDW though. So a person at the new tower who trades into WDW gets the benefit of the parking without having to pay for parking on their own accommodation. A person at WDW trading into the new tower pays the parking twice. Seems unfair and a way for DVC to try to pass more costs onto existing owners to keep the fees for the new buyers artificially low.

As I posted somewhere, the current lots already exist and nothing new was added.

So, since those belong to the hotel, there may not have been a way to determine an appropriate share to include for DVC owners, or the hotel division didn’t want it that way.

 

[CP3uhoh]

There's a lot of good points here and I'd guess that parking is going to end up being included. My question is why are the dues $9.06? They are providing NO transportation of any kind and added one pool which I assume can be used by the entire resort. WDW resorts have busses, boats, skyliner even, not following why this is such a premium. Granted GCV doesn't' have a dedicated pool and is MUCH smaller capacity wise but the gap there is striking.

 

[SL6827]

There's a lot of good points here and I'd guess that parking is going to end up being included. My question is why are the dues $9.06? They are providing NO transportation of any kind and added one pool which I assume can be used by the entire resort. WDW resorts have busses, boats, skyliner even, not following why this is such a premium. Granted GCV doesn't' have a dedicated pool and is MUCH smaller capacity wise but the gap there is striking.

Makes you wonder.

 

[Sandisw]

There's a lot of good points here and I'd guess that parking is going to end up being included. My question is why are the dues $9.06? They are providing NO transportation of any kind and added one pool which I assume can be used by the entire resort. WDW resorts have busses, boats, skyliner even, not following why this is such a premium. Granted GCV doesn't' have a dedicated pool and is MUCH smaller capacity wise but the gap there is striking.

Its possible that the tax portion of this is high? That is the breakdown we don't have yet...but I am sure we will have it by the time sales happen as it will be in the POS...

 

[CP3uhoh]

Its possible that the tax portion of this is high? That is the breakdown we don't have yet...but I am sure we will have it by the time sales happen as it will be in the POS...

i just find it a little ridiculous that the "resort" is still mainly a hotel, I don't care enough to add up the rooms etc but over 50% has to be hotel capacity, not DVC. Realizing that none of this is ever an "investment"opportunity, it is nice that DVC was/is not the typical timeshare. You can get out of it relatively easy if you want and it does save you money.That being said, it's a "real estate interest". Is it wise to be buying real estate in CA in 2023? Interesting question that all these breakdowns makes you ponder. WDW is vast resort area that has amenities and activities outside the park plus twice as many parks making frequent visits easier to justify because there's so much to do.

I do wonder if all this would have been better way tax and fee wise if they just converted Paradise/Pixar Pier into a DVC building and somehow swung a permit for a pedestrian bridge across the street that leads right into DCA. Will be fascinating to see how this sells now and also if the 7 month window isn't as difficult as you would think given the transient tax on top of the point allocation. From my perspective, the point chart isn't ridiculous so if you're trading in with points from almost any other resort especially if they are direct points purchase years ago, even after the tax a nice value and this is where they resale restrictions make sense from a member perspective. People with direct points or long time holders don't have to fight with people buying Saratoga or BR points resale for less than half and fight it out at 7 months.

As an aside, I'd love to hear the rationale by making the studios accommodate 4 and not 5 since the 1BR obviously has the trundle under the TV and god help this place if the GCV refurb down the road gets the murphy bed from the wall and the pull down under the TV.

 

[Sandisw]

i just find it a little ridiculous that the "resort" is still mainly a hotel, I don't care enough to add up the rooms etc but over 50% has to be hotel capacity, not DVC. Realizing that none of this is ever an "investment"opportunity, it is nice that DVC was/is not the typical timeshare. You can get out of it relatively easy if you want and it does save you money.That being said, it's a "real estate interest". Is it wise to be buying real estate in CA in 2023? Interesting question that all these breakdowns makes you ponder. WDW is vast resort area that has amenities and activities outside the park plus twice as many parks making frequent visits easier to justify because there's so much to do.

I do wonder if all this would have been better way tax and fee wise if they just converted Paradise/Pixar Pier into a DVC building and somehow swung a permit for a pedestrian bridge across the street that leads right into DCA. Will be fascinating to see how this sells now and also if the 7 month window isn't as difficult as you would think given the transient tax on top of the point allocation. From my perspective, the point chart isn't ridiculous so if you're trading in with points from almost any other resort especially if they are direct points purchase years ago, even after the tax a nice value and this is where they resale restrictions make sense from a member perspective. People with direct points or long time holders don't have to fight with people buying Saratoga or BR points resale for less than half and fight it out at 7 months.

As an aside, I'd love to hear the rationale by making the studios accommodate 4 and not 5 since the 1BR obviously has the trundle under the TV and god help this place if the GCV refurb down the road gets the murphy bed from the wall and the pull down under the TV.

I don't know enough about the location to comment on how it is situation in terms of it being a shared resort...but at the others, they do have some level of formula on how to split things that are common to the hotel and the DVC components.

We also don't know yet if the pool that was added to VDH is going to be a common element, paid only by DVC and restricted to those staying at VDH, or if it is going to have some level of reciprocal agreement like BRV does with WL for that pool....

Lots of unknowns..need the itemized budget