Wow how things have changed.

[TwoMisfits]

That would be like Universal for the one park to park day we are doing next March lol. It's $194 for the one day ticket two park ticket and $110 for the once for each ride fastpass per person. Ouch. I'm glad half of our party didn't want to go to Universal at all on this trip. (Doing the throw away deluxe room for the express pass (unlimited) that we didn't need as many recommend when I did the math was more not less expensive for the one day experience). And then tax is around $20 per ticket and express pass. So going over there is $324 pp for the day. Disney and SeaWorld are looking like real bargains to me in comparison. It will be super nice for folks in our party to have the one ride express pass at that super busy spring break time though.

Universal prices the way Disney used to - exponentially high if you only want 1 day, but huge discounts if you want more than 1 that just get bigger as you go...aka, they want most of your vacation time with 1 day elsewhere, not 1 day there and all other time elsewhere...

 

[CBMom01]

Universal prices the way Disney used to - exponentially high if you only want 1 day, but huge discounts if you want more than 1 that just get bigger as you go...aka, they want most of your vacation time with 1 day elsewhere, not 1 day there and all other time elsewhere...

Disney still works that way.

 

[TwoMisfits]

Disney still works that way.

Not like they used to - I remember the $10/day for days 4-10 at Disney that don't exist anymore...

Universal still has $20/day for days 3-5, and annual passes for out-of-state that can cost the same as the 5 day, depending on trip timing...so, you can keep going back for very little after 2 days at the park (with day 2 about 1/2 of day 1 - day 1 is where they get you)...

 

[Rileygirl]

I have been a disboarder for years. It was common in the last 15 years to always see SOME threads of people unhappy with change at Disney, but I have to say, I really can’t believe what is going on.

I am a super planner, and have always enjoyed the planning. The thrill of the hunt, the score of a great dining ressie, a trio of excellent and well timed fast passes, free dining hotel discount on the room and resort you wanted. I was good with it all.

I came back to this board to plan, hopefully, a trip at the end of the summer, for a family group of 8 people, and also a potential DVC purchase. (grandkids!) I don’t think that’s going to happen now. It’s like Disney is in systemic system failure. Before, there was some decline, but then there were a lot of amazing things added. Under the leadership of the new guy, things appear to be imploding.

The cost alone is horrifying. Adding genie + to eight tickets, and then individual top ride expenses on top of the price of a ticket? The annual pass is not only stupid expensive, but now I question whether it will always be around as it’s been unavailable for purchase for periods of time, and if you buy into DVC, aps always made the best sense.

i think people would object less to genie + if it actually worked, so there is that. And perhaps, genie works really well for someone who does not plan or a first time visitor? Maybe it’s only messing up us Uber planners?

But there are other things that are indicators of a crumbling giant when you read through these many threads, and the frequency of these complaints and threads means to me that there really is cause for concern.

Dirty bathrooms and litter? Walt would be horrified. Lack of custodial service really represents that the ideals original to Walt Disney are of no importance anymore. I would also add, making the park so expensive that it’s becoming unattainable for the average family to afford is also counter to Walt’s vision.

Lack of bus and boat transportation? Monorail undependable? No Trams in the parking lot? Yikes. ( I could easily take my three young kids to Disney back in the day, because I knew I could reliably get around to the parks and hotel without a problem. When they added magical express, that made it even better- now that is going too)

The absolute decline of food quality. But this has been going on for years in my opinion- although I have not dined here in years, many people who I have sent with restaurants recommendations come back and say, really??

But the biggest thing that just blows my mind, that makes me know the mouse is coughing up blood while someone is strangling it, it’s the new Star Wars hotel. Omg, have you seen this state of the art 6,000 grand for two nights hotel? Holy cow. Every imagineer must be slinking around completely mortified. They must have been given ten bucks and an account at the dollar store for set design. Truly unbelievable. It does not even look like Star Wars! It looks like a generic sci fit set, based on the 1960s show, lost in space!. And the interactive features seem completely lame, such a huge miss, I can’t even fathom it.

It will be interesting to see how guests find it when it opens in March. But I think it’s pretty telling that every date is available for booking in June, July, and August. It was fully booked for the first three months, but now there is availability- likely due to cancellations?

i think cost, genie +, and the new leader are just killing WDW. The direction it’s going is not one I want to see anyways, and that makes me sad. But a dirty, expensive, crowded, trip, where you are required to plan each morning at 7 am or stand in long lines, preorder mediocre food, and only be able half in the parks what I could do, well, it’s not all that attractive to me. I think I will wait a year and see how things are going.

 

[AnnaKristoff2013]

Yup - Disney has turned from the happiest place on earth to something straight from Orwell's 1984. The changes are bad enough - but the continually pushing from Disney about how wonderful all these changes are for the guest with the fake smiles plastered on the faces is starting to get downright eerie. They treat the customer as if they were stupid and will believe anything they are told about how their complete cash grab which benefits nearly no one other than the pockets of executives while allowing them to continue to make cuts which affect guests and on the ground cast members is the best thing ever. "The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears . . . " I think it's their continual framing of every cut, price increase, and reduction in flexibility as good for the guest when clearly they know how much harder they're making the vacation which is the worst part of it.

Disney has always been at war with EastAsia.

 

[kathy884]

Universal prices the way Disney used to - exponentially high if you only want 1 day, but huge discounts if you want more than 1 that just get bigger as you go...aka, they want most of your vacation time with 1 day elsewhere, not 1 day there and all other time elsewhere...

For sure -- and with trips to Orlando just every two or three years, relatives to visit, and other parks we like, and typically a fairly short trip four to seven night trip, we never want more than one day there. That means it's a big dollar outlay when you look at cost per day. We usually just do a one day park to park ticket every six years or so to check out new stuff and old favorites (interesting park with all the HP stuff, but we are bigger fans of Disney and SeaWorld).

 

[ofcabbagesandkings]

I remember our firet disney trip in 2016 coming home and telling a friend how everything at Disney World makes it easy for families. Magical express with luggage delivered so you don’t have to push a stroller and haul a suitcase at the same time, three fast passes you could book ahead so on the day of you don’t have to worry about figuring out what to do, big buffets where even the pickiest eaters could eat well and the characters come right up to your table. I said all those things because that’s what made Disney stand out at a vacation destination. We’ve been several times in 2021 and each time it just felt like WORK. Such a shame. I think the people making decisions at Disney HQ are just totally out of touch with the guest experience. They need to spend a day in Hollywood studios as a regular guest with no VIP tour and see if that is an experience they would pay for.

This is exactly it. Even my DH, a Disney Scrooge, marveled at how easy it was to vacation with our kids at Disney compared to other destinations we had taken them. The included hotel to park transportation and Magical Express, the ability to rent a stroller from an offsite vendor and have it waiting for you at Bell Services, free Magic Bands shipped to your home that would unlock your door and admit you to the parks and your FP reservations, the clean bathrooms with child-height sinks in the restaurants, the genuinely good food that we got included with our Free Dining package. The minute I stepped on the plane, the planning was over and I could relax, my vacation had begun. But it's all just stress and work now, at a premium price. WDW execs aren't feeling it yet, but word will spread. I already told my best friend and now she's considering Universal for her next Orlando trip instead. I expect return visitor numbers to crash. Maybe there will be enough first timers to make up for it, I guess time will tell.

 

[pepperw23]

This thread makes me so sad. As a long time Disney fan, I know they go through these "valley's" sometimes. This "Valley" is starting to feel too deep to dig out of. I sure hope someone within Disney comes to their senses.

 

[bdiddy]

This thread makes me so sad. As a long time Disney fan, I know they go through these "valley's" sometimes. This "Valley" is starting to feel too deep to dig out of. I sure hope someone within Disney comes to their senses.

Me too! This just feels so different than just regular annoying changes in the past. I’ve been on these boards for a long time too and I’ve never seen anything like this. So many long time Disney lovers really seem to be losing the magic and excitement then ever before.

 

[Jennasis]

We are at Epcot today. Touring old school...no Genie, no genie+. No buying LL access. Just enjoying the Festival and a few rides.

We have a trash can full of sweets back at our redort that looked good in the case but tasted blech...a slice of Gideons cake, 3 different donuts from Everglazed.I'more disappointment from Disney.

The parks are so so crowded. The pent up demand from the pandemic is in full effect. But a lot of miserable and confused people out here.

We did get a boarding group for Remy at 1pm and it's come due now at 7pm...and the wait is around 40 minutes. Ridiculous that you have to snag a virtual queue to stand in a 40 min line.

However today was still a WAY better day than our two Genie+ days.

 

[TandT]

We are here now . We have been going to Disney since 2007. A lot of changes we noticed. This particular week is historically not supposed to be THIS crowded . We don’t care for Genie and paying for LL. We are really trying to make the best of it. This is our vacation and we are trying to be smart about navigating the crowds and getting the most out of the parks .. with a 6 year old lol.

We are DVC members and we did decide instead of using our points in the near future for another Disney trip , we are banking our points for a Disney Cruise instead . Because I have to say , we were on the Dream a week before we got here and it was AMAZING!! No crowds, clean environment, great food and amazing service. Just my observation

 

[dvcgirl67]

We are here now . We have been going to Disney since 2007. A lot of changes we noticed. This particular week is historically not supposed to be THIS crowded . We don’t care for Genie and paying for LL. We are really trying to make the best of it. This is our vacation and we are trying to be smart about navigating the crowds and getting the most out of the parks .. with a 6 year old lol.

We are DVC members and we did decide instead of using our points in the near future for another Disney trip , we are banking our points for a Disney Cruise instead . Because I have to say , we were on the Dream a week before we got here and it was AMAZING!! No crowds, clean environment, great food and amazing service. Just my observation

That makes a lot of sense, as from what I'm reading the cruises sound amazing now. The only downside with booking a cruise is if you have to test prior to boarding because a positive test could mean you can't board. This is what is holding DH and me from traveling internationally right now. The chance of testing positive on the way out of the country would be low for us because we would really avoid people for the week before. But coming back...is a crap shoot....and having to quarantine...etc, would kind of suck. Hope you enjoy the rest of your trip!

 

[JTlikestheDuck]

I'm also disappointed in what Disney world has become. We went last weekend and the most enjoyable part was the After Hours Event, you could actually get on rides timely. But outside of that, it was over crowded and people have become really obnoxious. I saw numerous instances where people were jerks to Castmembers and other guests just because they couldn't get their way. It was awful. And when did Epcot become a complete adult drunkfest? I get the ability to walk around with a beer (I do) but the HUGE lines to just get alcohol ($9+) and the drunks cursing and being boorish, come on. Epcot is no longer a place for kids or sane adults. I'm lucky that Disney is 2hrs away and we're passholders so it's not as stressful to get everything in but I would not fly in and spend a week there. Way too much stress. On a positive note, Disney was training new castmembers everywhere. So hopefully that will make a difference.

 

[0FF TO NEVERLAND]

I’m more pissed about waking up at 7 everyday for this crap honestly. I sleep in a little on my vacations

 

[CaliforniaGirl09]

I agree with the previous posters who think that this low feels different. I've been going to Disneyland off and on for 45+ years, but those every-other-year trips turned into multiple trips per year when I had a special needs son about 25 years ago. He *loves* Disney, and all things Disney have been a huge part of our lives since he was around 2.

We bought VGC when it came out, added on more points there later, and added on to WDW at BLT when RunDisney stopped doing the west coast races. We're platinum cruisers (13?) and have done 7 or 8 Adventures by Disney. We've been to every Disney park around the world and have probably averaged 4-5 DLR/WDW trips per year--a number of those around races--pre-pandemic. I don't want to add up how much money we've spent at Disney over the last 20+ years--I'm sure it's obscene.

You can definitely say that we are huge Disney fans. But we, too, are at the point where we will be severely limiting our Disney time. As other people have expressed, there have just been too many changes that have negatively impacted our Disney experience, and I really wonder what the guy at the helm is thinking. I know they historically haven't cared much about losing customers like us (there are always replacements), but I have to think that this is going to eventually catch up to them.

My first big disappointment was at the beginning of the pandemic with how Adventures by Disney handled canceling trips and offering refunds. I won't rehash here, but it was horrible. I loved ABD--and was one of the product's biggest cheerleaders in the early years--but recent missteps have made me unlikely to ever tour with them again.

But it's the recent changes at the parks that have made us decide to cut back severely on our visits. If it were just me and my husband, we would probably be done completely. But with our SN son, we will probably continue to do one or two trips to Disneyland per year and stop going to WDW 2 or 3 times a year for races. I'm planing to put our BLT points up for sale in the spring after the last race I'm signed up for (Princess). I'm sad, because I do like the races, but everything else has just become so complicated and frankly, unfun to think about--not to mention the added $$$ without a real benefit like you would get with an all access type pass. I won't be a happy camper if I pay for a specific ride and end up waiting 30 minutes in a "lightning" lane, as I've read in other threads about ROTR.

Others have posted great lists of why the park experience has changed in a negative way for them, and I agree with almost all of them. We are late risers so the 7 am part of the equation is horrible for us. It was bad (and stressful) enough with just virtual queues, but at least I could limit those early wake ups to specific days. Waking up every day of my vacation pre-7 am to try to get the rides we want? No thanks. The other biggie for me is being forced to have my phone out all day. At Disney, I want to get away from my phone not be attached to it.

I was in the camp of Disney planning as a sport, not necessarily because I loved it, but because I was good at it, and it led to really fun trips. I get that they think they needed to change things so as to not disadvantage the non-planner or guest who had no idea they needed to do x, but they seem to have gone to the other extreme with the rules surrounding Genie+ allowing no-planning and potentially messing up existing plans (i.e. choosing a LL and then having the time change to interfere with an ADR).

Anyway, thanks to the OP for giving me a place to mourn. I feel like in some ways I'm saying goodbye to what has been a really fun time of our lives. I know nothing stays the same, and change is going to happen, but it feels as if this time it was too much too fast.

 

[Rileygirl]

Somebody has posted a new thread called deepdive into fast pass and genie plus, and they have given a link to the most amazing 2 hr utube video. I now understand why I hate Disney genie so much. This is an outstanding thread, and I recommend you to check it out!

 

[kathy884]

Somebody has posted a new thread called deepdive into fast pass and genie plus, and they have given a link to the most amazing 2 hr utube video. I now understand why I hate Disney genie so much. This is an outstanding thread, and I recommend you to check it out!

Thank you for the recommendation! Really enjoyed the link.

 

[TandT]

I agree with the previous posters who think that this low feels different. I've been going to Disneyland off and on for 45+ years, but those every-other-year trips turned into multiple trips per year when I had a special needs son about 25 years ago. He *loves* Disney, and all things Disney have been a huge part of our lives since he was around 2.

We bought VGC when it came out, added on more points there later, and added on to WDW at BLT when RunDisney stopped doing the west coast races. We're platinum cruisers (13?) and have done 7 or 8 Adventures by Disney. We've been to every Disney park around the world and have probably averaged 4-5 DLR/WDW trips per year--a number of those around races--pre-pandemic. I don't want to add up how much money we've spent at Disney over the last 20+ years--I'm sure it's obscene.

You can definitely say that we are huge Disney fans. But we, too, are at the point where we will be severely limiting our Disney time. As other people have expressed, there have just been too many changes that have negatively impacted our Disney experience, and I really wonder what the guy at the helm is thinking. I know they historically haven't cared much about losing customers like us (there are always replacements), but I have to think that this is going to eventually catch up to them.

My first big disappointment was at the beginning of the pandemic with how Adventures by Disney handled canceling trips and offering refunds. I won't rehash here, but it was horrible. I loved ABD--and was one of the product's biggest cheerleaders in the early years--but recent missteps have made me unlikely to ever tour with them again.

But it's the recent changes at the parks that have made us decide to cut back severely on our visits. If it were just me and my husband, we would probably be done completely. But with our SN son, we will probably continue to do one or two trips to Disneyland per year and stop going to WDW 2 or 3 times a year for races. I'm planing to put our BLT points up for sale in the spring after the last race I'm signed up for (Princess). I'm sad, because I do like the races, but everything else has just become so complicated and frankly, unfun to think about--not to mention the added $$$ without a real benefit like you would get with an all access type pass. I won't be a happy camper if I pay for a specific ride and end up waiting 30 minutes in a "lightning" lane, as I've read in other threads about ROTR.

Others have posted great lists of why the park experience has changed in a negative way for them, and I agree with almost all of them. We are late risers so the 7 am part of the equation is horrible for us. It was bad (and stressful) enough with just virtual queues, but at least I could limit those early wake ups to specific days. Waking up every day of my vacation pre-7 am to try to get the rides we want? No thanks. The other biggie for me is being forced to have my phone out all day. At Disney, I want to get away from my phone not be attached to it.

I was in the camp of Disney planning as a sport, not necessarily because I loved it, but because I was good at it, and it led to really fun trips. I get that they think they needed to change things so as to not disadvantage the non-planner or guest who had no idea they needed to do x, but they seem to have gone to the other extreme with the rules surrounding Genie+ allowing no-planning and potentially messing up existing plans (i.e. choosing a LL and then having the time change to interfere with an ADR).

Anyway, thanks to the OP for giving me a place to mourn. I feel like in some ways I'm saying goodbye to what has been a really fun time of our lives. I know nothing stays the same, and change is going to happen, but it feels as if this time it was too much too fast.

I agree with you about having to have my phone in my hand the whole day It is really annoying. All you see in the parks are a bunch of people walking around like robots glued to their phone trying not to run into eachother
And yes waking up at 7am to frantically book the most popular attractions in the park and pay for them is ridiculous. Walt would not be happy . That’s all I’m going to say lol

 

[fbarker]

I bet we’ve all changed in varying ways the last few years. Why should a corporation be any different?

I just hope we have changed in a positive or better way. WDW has not!! and that is not good. They are taking their long built franchise for granted and there is a great chance that will come back to haunt them.

 

[Boardwalk III]

I have been a disboarder for years. It was common in the last 15 years to always see SOME threads of people unhappy with change at Disney, but I have to say, I really can’t believe what is going on.

I am a super planner, and have always enjoyed the planning. The thrill of the hunt, the score of a great dining ressie, a trio of excellent and well timed fast passes, free dining hotel discount on the room and resort you wanted. I was good with it all.

I came back to this board to plan, hopefully, a trip at the end of the summer, for a family group of 8 people, and also a potential DVC purchase. (grandkids!) I don’t think that’s going to happen now. It’s like Disney is in systemic system failure. Before, there was some decline, but then there were a lot of amazing things added. Under the leadership of the new guy, things appear to be imploding.

The cost alone is horrifying. Adding genie + to eight tickets, and then individual top ride expenses on top of the price of a ticket? The annual pass is not only stupid expensive, but now I question whether it will always be around as it’s been unavailable for purchase for periods of time, and if you buy into DVC, aps always made the best sense.

i think people would object less to genie + if it actually worked, so there is that. And perhaps, genie works really well for someone who does not plan or a first time visitor? Maybe it’s only messing up us Uber planners?

But there are other things that are indicators of a crumbling giant when you read through these many threads, and the frequency of these complaints and threads means to me that there really is cause for concern.

Dirty bathrooms and litter? Walt would be horrified. Lack of custodial service really represents that the ideals original to Walt Disney are of no importance anymore. I would also add, making the park so expensive that it’s becoming unattainable for the average family to afford is also counter to Walt’s vision.

Lack of bus and boat transportation? Monorail undependable? No Trams in the parking lot? Yikes. ( I could easily take my three young kids to Disney back in the day, because I knew I could reliably get around to the parks and hotel without a problem. When they added magical express, that made it even better- now that is going too)

The absolute decline of food quality. But this has been going on for years in my opinion- although I have not dined here in years, many people who I have sent with restaurants recommendations come back and say, really??

But the biggest thing that just blows my mind, that makes me know the mouse is coughing up blood while someone is strangling it, it’s the new Star Wars hotel. Omg, have you seen this state of the art 6,000 grand for two nights hotel? Holy cow. Every imagineer must be slinking around completely mortified. They must have been given ten bucks and an account at the dollar store for set design. Truly unbelievable. It does not even look like Star Wars! It looks like a generic sci fit set, based on the 1960s show, lost in space!. And the interactive features seem completely lame, such a huge miss, I can’t even fathom it.

It will be interesting to see how guests find it when it opens in March. But I think it’s pretty telling that every date is available for booking in June, July, and August. It was fully booked for the first three months, but now there is availability- likely due to cancellations?

i think cost, genie +, and the new leader are just killing WDW. The direction it’s going is not one I want to see anyways, and that makes me sad. But a dirty, expensive, crowded, trip, where you are required to plan each morning at 7 am or stand in long lines, preorder mediocre food, and only be able half in the parks what I could do, well, it’s not all that attractive to me. I think I will wait a year and see how things are going.

Long term Dis-boarder myself (as well as 20 year DVC member). After a two-year hiatus we returned in mid-November for 12 days. Unfortunately I agree with most of your sentiments, and found Genie+ plus to be a big disappointment, even with lots of planning (using stacking etc). Had bought a new AP and have another trip planned for April but may simply pass and bank those points in hopes of better times. Sigh.

The only area where I would disagree with you has to do with food quality. We probably ate at 20 sit-down restaurants over our 12 days there, and found the food to be better than ever, and in some cases amazing. We’re pretty discerning when it comes to food quality, and we were all very pleasantly surprised. The only disappointment we had was at Beaches & Cream, but that had more to do with the expansion of the space & loss of character. And burgers were just so-so.

And also a shout out to the Cast Members, who in my opinion continue to go above and beyond even during trying times. Yes there were a few who had no business being in guest-facing roles, but for the most part we found them to be terrific.

Finally, after voicing my displeasure recently on one of these boards another member urged me to make my concerns known to WDW, and I did just that. I’d recommend you do the same and forward your comments to: wdw.guest.communications@disneyworld.com.

Who knows if it will make a difference, but it just seems the right thing to do!