Curious .... what agreement do you have with your college student as far as tuition?

[MichelleB]

I really appreciate everyone's views on this. It helps a great deal. We want to make sure we're doing as much as possible to set our kids up for success and not bog them down with financial worries. I do believe they need to contribute something and this gives me a good handle on what things to consider. I also am not a proponent of loans. We have worked very hard to be debt free except for our house and know the value of not having such hanging over our heads. I want whatever we ask our kids to contribute to be attainable through a reasonable work schedule. I have asked many parents that we know the same thing and have been surprised at the number of parents that help with books and the rest is up to the young adult. I am not an advocate of that. We want to have the kids contribute but again ... a reasonable amount. Thank you again for all the different sides represented here.

 

[Calliaz]

We have also started pushing our kids into the STEM sectors, even at young ages. I have a hard time paying for a 4 year college degree in a field that makes it very hard to get a return on that investment. Yes, there is a need for most degrees, but it is amazing to me how many kids go to college for: History, Psychology, Sociology, Philosophy, etc etc etc. Yes, all are valid degrees, until it comes to employment. I want my kids to know that the costs towards college will be covered in a line of work/career that is going to help them prosper down and hopefully and easier life. There is no guarantees, and I know there are a hundred stories of those in liberal arts fields with success in life, but it is not as easy as if you are in the STEM sector. Again, my opinion, but a very valid one.

You are certainly entitled to your opinion; however, I would encourage you to do some additional research on this issue. First, are you talking employment or pay? There isn't anything to say that people with liberal arts degrees can't get jobs. Sometimes they are in lower-paying, but still very important, careers. I think it is up to the person to decide if their life is about making the most money or being in a career they love. Second, people with liberal arts degrees often make just as much as those with other degrees over the course of their life (https://www.insidehighered.com/news...ds-really-fare-report-examines-long-term-data). The last thing I will add is that the majority of my students (university students who have ended up on academic probation for low grades) are there because they are in the wrong major. They have no passion or drive for what they are studying. Most are told by their parents that they will only pay for them to be an engineer or business major. They are failing because they are not motivated. People who are forced into choosing a major based on a career that "makes money" are often also not motivated once they graduate and need to find a job. I'd hire an English major with passion and drive over your run-of-the-mill biology major any day. I have now worked with over 1,000 students on academic probation at a major university. My advice to my own child is to find something he is passionate about and to make a plan for how he will find a career in that major. If he wants to be a history major, how is he going to pay for grad school (which is likely needed)? What internships is he going to get? What skills is he going to acquire to make him the best choice in the market?

 

[Southernmiss]

We do not subscribe to the "skin in the game" theory. Especially if "skin in the game" means that an 18-19 year old is taking out loans. I just don't think that many young people truly understand the impact of those loans on their future. Now working to cover some of the cost, I'm all for that.

DD19 is in her second year of college. She worked super hard in high school and scholarships cover 75% of her tuition. To me, that demonstrates that she has "skin in the game." She has to maintain her gpa to keep those scholarships. We cover the remaining 25% of her tuition and the room and board costs as well as many incidentals- books, supplies, car repairs, as well as all the living expenses we always paid. Freshman year she was in the dorm but this year is in an apartment so we cover groceries.

She has a really awesome job that combines a lifelong passion with gaining experience in her field. She works 12-14 hours a week and that covers her gas and spending money.

We also pay about 60% of her sorority cost and she covers the rest from her Summer job.

This 1000 times over.

Op, what are your daughter's act/sat scores? Is she eligible for or applying for scholarships? By this time in senior year, it's down to decisions based on offers received.
We told our kids to pick the school they got the best offer at and could graduate with the least amount of debt. We've got good in state schools with a variety of programs.

Our kids work as soccer referees from age 12 up on the weekends and save $ for cars and to help with college expenses. And work hard to keep grades and test scores up.

Oldest ds got a full scholarships to his college. He's graduating in May. His part was making the grades to keep his scholarships. He continues to referee soccer for $ and did have 2 part-time jobs that he wanted to have because he likes to be social and that's expensive. He also works summers.

Ds#2 also received scholarships to his college. For all but $2000 per year which we cover. His program will be more rigorous than oldest ds's and 2nd son doesn't like to go out as much and is doing ok with the $ in his savings. So he's not working while going to school. We expect him to keep his gpa up to keep his scholarships. That's his skin in the game--hate that phrase. He'll work this summer.

So far so good. We've got 2 more kids looking at college in 2 and 4 years and I expect it to go similarly.

I've learned through this process to ease up on expecting kids to work steady jobs in college. I believe it's more rigorous than 25 years ago when I was in college, and certainly a lot more expensive. In fact, Dh and I are at a place in our careers where we changed some things to earn more income so our kids aren't expected to stress over work and classes in college, like we did.

Op there's another active college thread on the community board started by mefordis you might want to read.

 

[Nebraska_Disney]

I have a hard time telling any student to take $60-80 thousand in debt for a job that will never give you return on that investment. For a new liberal arts graduate, how are they going to make payments on that loan with they are making $25-35 thousand a year? The numbers don't add up. There are very good technical schools and certificate programs out there as well, as a 4 year degree is not for everyone either. Yes, it is great to be passionate about your job/career, but it also has to make sense. Most of the people I know with liberal arts degrees, who are making decent to good pay, are doing so in jobs not even related to their degree (retail business, food services, insurance claims etc). So, I do agree you can succeed, it may not be in your area of training. Or, you better plan on grad school right from the start.

 

[crisi]

Our son wants to go to trade school. His 529 will more than cover that, plus we will pick up an apartment and car and subsidize some living expenses while he moves through apprenticeship.

My daughter is planning on going to a four year private liberal arts college. We will pay for pretty much everything except her own personal expenses unless she picks a very expensive school, in which case she may need to take out loans.

The best gift my parents gave me was getting out of college with no loans. That allowed me to buy a house when most of my friends couldn't because they had loans. I had no problem getting decent grades with no "skin in the game" - the skin I had in the game was a desire to get a decent education.

 

[MichelleB]

Op, what are your daughter's act/sat scores? Is she eligible for or applying for scholarships? By this time in senior year, it's down to decisions based on offers received.
We told our kids to pick the school they got the best offer at and could graduate with the least amount of debt. We've got good in state schools with a variety of programs.

She's got a weighted GPA of 4.04 and ACT was 27. She took the ACT 4 times and the SAT 2 times. She did receive merit scholarships to the schools she applied and the figure for school (tuition and room/board) is $18,000-25,000 after those scholarships. She did apply at a prestigious art college and got scholarships there but even after, it's $32,000 a year. If she chooses that one, she'll be responsible for paying more. I'd love to be able to help her go there but I just don't see how we can swing that and honestly think it's overpriced for what she wants to do after graduating. We're trying to help her see why that would not be a good return on investment and that taking on such debt would not be a wise choice. We can cover up to about $22,000 per year for school. Once my son enters, we'll have an overlap year and that one year will be a real stretch to cover that for both but we'll make that sacrifice when the time comes. To date, she's only applied for 1 scholarship outside of merit based. I've been asking her to do so and make it her "job" other than schooling but it's not happened. We've never allowed them to have a job during the school year because we felt their focus being on their grades netted them more in scholarships than what they'd make at a job. She does house/pet sit for a neighbor and things like that during the school year as she wants since those are short term.

She wants to be a graphic designer and has spoken to several that work in the field already. She's been told to expect somewhere in the $35,000-38,000 pay starting out.

 

[TwoMisfits]

If she wants to go to the expensive school, she'll need to come up with $40K extra...maybe you could encourage her to take a gap year to work full time in order to make a big dent in that kind of cost (a year of being a nanny should get her at least $20-$25K - heck, a year working for $9 would net her $10K-$12K after taxes/expenses)...if the college would hold the scholarship/merit aid for a year, that might be a good option. She gets what she wants and you still get what you want - her not graduating with enormous debt...

 

[MichelleB]

Will schools hold scholarships? I have no experience with this. A good idea if so.

 

[sk!mom]

She's got a weighted GPA of 4.04 and ACT was 27. She took the ACT 4 times and the SAT 2 times. She did receive merit scholarships to the schools she applied and the figure for school (tuition and room/board) is $18,000-25,000 after those scholarships. She did apply at a prestigious art college and got scholarships there but even after, it's $32,000 a year. If she chooses that one, she'll be responsible for paying more. I'd love to be able to help her go there but I just don't see how we can swing that and honestly think it's overpriced for what she wants to do after graduating. We're trying to help her see why that would not be a good return on investment and that taking on such debt would not be a wise choice. We can cover up to about $22,000 per year for school. Once my son enters, we'll have an overlap year and that one year will be a real stretch to cover that for both but we'll make that sacrifice when the time comes. To date, she's only applied for 1 scholarship outside of merit based. I've been asking her to do so and make it her "job" other than schooling but it's not happened. We've never allowed them to have a job during the school year because we felt their focus being on their grades netted them more in scholarships than what they'd make at a job. She does house/pet sit for a neighbor and things like that during the school year as she wants since those are short term.

She wants to be a graphic designer and has spoken to several that work in the field already. She's been told to expect somewhere in the $35,000-38,000 pay starting out.

Wow…our DD's are very similar- grades, scores, college offers, and future plans. Has your DD visited both colleges? I ask because that was the deciding factor for my DD19. Her decision had come down to a private or a State University. The state Uni offered a merit scholarship that would cover 75% of her tuition and fees. The private offered $15K but the difference in cost of attendance was huge.

After visiting, DD chose the state school for several reasons. For one, while she would be studying fashion design they had a huge variety of art classes that she would be able to explore while pursuing that degree. Her University is in a major metro area and she wanted the opportunities of big city living both for "things to do" and internship/job possibilities. The private is in a small city much like where she grew up.

It has worked out well so far. As I said up thread, she has a part-time job that gives her some experience. She just signed a contact this week for a paid Social Media internship for a fashion company in the area. She had met with them to secure a Summer internship and through the meeting they offered her this opportunity to start working with them now. She assures me that she has time for it all. She loves the idea of exploring the Social media field.

Her working so hard to keep the merit scholarship and now pursuing opportunities on her own at 19 demonstrates that she's "in the game" to me.

In my experience, students are either "in it" or not and taking loans or paying part doesn't motivate an unmotivated student. They just waste your money, their money, and the loan money. If I had an unmotivated kid or a kid who wasn't ready to go away, I'd keep them home for a couple of years to go to Community college or the local small public University until they grew up a bit and showed some motivation.

Good luck as you make this tough decision!

 

[crisi]

In my experience, students are either "in it" or not and taking loans or paying part doesn't motivate an unmotivated student. They just waste your money, their money, and the loan money. If I had an unmotivated kid or a kid who wasn't ready to go away, I'd keep them home for a couple of years to go to Community college or the local small public University until they grew up a bit and showed some motivation.

I had just had this same thought. Kids who were motivated to do well in college, ready for college, interested in the academic environment of college and picked the right college (some combination of those factors) did well. Kids who wanted to party until they failed out or the money was pulled did that regardless of who was picking up the tab. Kids who weren't ready for college, or weren't ready for the college they had picked, were simply not ready.

If you think your kid won't do well without "skin in the game" - back up and ask yourself if they are mature enough for a four year school. Maybe they need to spend a year working, or some time at a community college. Maybe they need a different school, that living in the dorms at "State Party School" might not be as good a choice as "Commuter School" or "State Serious School." Maybe they are being pushed towards a field of study (by themselves, you, teachers, counselors) that they honestly don't find that intriguing - no matter how many good jobs are available in STEM fields, if your kid hates Math (even though they are good at it when they apply themselves), that path doesn't have a high probability of success for graduation - and if they graduate, they may be miserable in their career.

My son is completely unmotivated for four year college. It doesn't matter if he pays for it or I pay for it. What appeals to him is the idea of living in a dorm, all you can eat cafeterias, being able to schedule your classes for 2 in the afternoon and sleeping in. He is not going to a four year college with ANY of my money right after college. But he'll haul his backend out of bed at 6am for a 7am job as a construction assistant (he moves sheetrock and tile) - I'm not worried about his work ethic - when he is driving it.

My daughter is much more academically inclined. She'll get distracted, so its important she picks a field she is interested at a school she is engaged in. But I'm not worried about her dropping out (she might fail a class or two as part of the learning exercise in responsibility and time management, that's why there is Summer School and the opportunity to take an extra class during a semester).

 

[eliza61]

So when I went to school there were no such thing as 529's or 401k's, lol My parent's paid 100% of my tuition, room and board for which I am eternally grateful. My son's also will have that opportunity. my oldest is a special needs kid so he's on a different track. My youngest has a athletic scholarships that pays about 1/2 his tuition. since he plays college sports he can't work and that's ok.

When they do work we have the rule of "10%". 10% goes into saving, 10% goes to the house and the rest is theirs.

I did encourage my kids to go away to college, I went away and it was one of the most influential things I've ever done

 

[Marionnette]

Our agreement was simple: We pay. You graduate.

All 3 finished their undergrad degrees in 4 years (which is rare nowadays). Beginning their adult lives without the anchor of a student loan enabled them to take advantage of opportunities that they may have had to pass up because of the need to pay back huge sums of money.

 

[Vernie822]

I paid for my own college expenses. My parents purchased a new laptop for me going into my freshman year. I'm the oldest of 5 so it was understood that I was going to college and I was going to pay for it myself lol. I ended up getting a great scholarship at a private university and only owed $2000 my freshman year after scholarships and all that. $15,000 ish total over 3.5 years after all was said and done. It's really nice that you can contribute to your daughter's education! Maybe you can make her responsible for her books (a couple hundred each semester, at least) and a % of her tuition?

 

[bcbmommy]

We're paying for it all, and believe that our daughter's job is to do her best in college. She's a straight A student, so she's taking care of her end of the bargain. If we had a child who was out partying their college years away, however, we wouldn't be paying a dime.

 

[MommaBerd]

Will schools hold scholarships? I have no experience with this. A good idea if so.

Some will, some won't. You'll have to ask the school.

On another note, my husband utilizes graphic designers in his business. He advises young people who want to be graphic designers to pair it with a complementary minor (or double-major) like video production (he would especially like to have someone with that combo of skills) or even marketing. And she needs to really focus on gaining experience and building her portfolio. Not trying to be a Debbie Downer, but things to think about in light of discussing financial options.

 

[disneyeveryyear]

We have told our children they are responsible for $5,000 each year toward their education. We have 529 plans for each of them and I have been able to cash bankroll 3 of our son's 8 semesters, so there will be some available for his grad school also. We had told them they would be able to graduate from a 4 year degree program with no debt (something neither my DH or I had - we paid loans for 10 years).

Both kids worked during high school and our DS21 also worked summers during college (2 jobs at times). We don't expect him to work during the school year because he is an Architecture major, and his time in the studio (approximately 40 hours per week on top of 12 hours in class, plus three other classes) is too overwhelming. We want him to focus on his studies, not work.

Our DD17 is hoping to go to a military academy, but we understand that can be difficult. She already has about 3 semesters worth of her college contribution in her savings account. We require them to put 50% of their paychecks into savings.

They are responsible for gas in their cars, but we pay for major repairs, cell phones, etc.

 

[Mrs. A Right]

I only have 2 that have/will go to college but I made the same deal to both: I pay for all tuition, room & board, books and transportation. If you need to retake a class, it's on your nickel. So far there has only been one class that needed to be retaken. She's paying.

 

[PlutoPony]

Our agreement was simple: We pay. You graduate.

All 3 finished their undergrad degrees in 4 years (which is rare nowadays). Beginning their adult lives without the anchor of a student loan enabled them to take advantage of opportunities that they may have had to pass up because of the need to pay back huge sums of money.

This is pretty much our philosophy. My husband and I both were fortunate to graduate with no debt and it's something we want to do for our son as well. It's going to take him an extra semester (or maybe 2) to finish because he changed majors into engineering. It's a tough major to do in 4 years anyway at his school - it takes 132 hrs vs the std 120 - so an extra semester would likely have been necessary even if he'd started out in engineering. He is responsible for all spending $ and things that aren't in the necessary category like parking pass, fraternity dues, football tickets, etc.

We also expect him to do things to grow personally and gain experience that will benefit him in the future. Internships, a few clubs, leadership positions where possible. NOT tons of activities but a few things other than go to class was an expectation from the outset. He worked at an internship in his field last summer and this winter break when he was home, and plans to do the same this summer and in future breaks.

Even though we are footing this, he's the one who actually pays the bills - tuition, rent, utilities, etc. May seem like a minor thing but we want him to be aware of how much $ is going out, be responsible for payment deadlines, etc. We give him 6 months living expenses at a time (rent, utilities, food budget) and he takes care of if from there. At the end of 6 months he posts actuals in a rudimentary spreadsheet and we jointly decide whether each category needs adjusted. For example, their electric bill was higher than he thought (we thought he was estimating low at the get go) so we bumped that up at Christmas when we went through the numbers.

 

[sk!mom]

Even though we are footing this, he's the one who actually pays the bills - tuition, rent, utilities, etc. May seem like a minor thing but we want him to be aware of how much $ is going out, be responsible for payment deadlines, etc. We give him 6 months living expenses at a time (rent, utilities, food budget) and he takes care of if from there. At the end of 6 months he posts actuals in a rudimentary spreadsheet and we jointly decide whether each category needs adjusted. For example, their electric bill was higher than he thought (we thought he was estimating low at the get go) so we bumped that up at Christmas when we went through the numbers.

We do the something similar with DD's bills. DH transfers to her and she pays rent. We've had her building credit by charging groceries to a cc that she got this summer and then we pay it. I like your idea of giving her a budget for that, as well, that she manages and pays. I'm going to talk to DH about having her keep a spreadsheet and budget.

 

[ThisIsJason]

I don't have kids, but my parents did it this way. My sister and I could go to whatever school we wanted, and they would pay for two years (fall and spring semesters only, no summer), and books for all semesters we took classes. They would not pay for living expenses (either college provided or private).

I started out at the local community college. I had no clue what I wanted to do yet and it was super cheap ($50 a credit hour at the time). Did four semesters there and did 15-16 credits each semester. Transferred to a four year college and my parents paid for those two years, and I got enough in scholarships to cover living in a on campus studio apartment for free both years. Had a part time job to pay for food. Had to do one more semester and I had to pay for it. Lived in a rental with my fiancée (now wife). I had to get a small loan for classes and some of the living expenses.