Enthusiastic about Genie+ touring

[cakebaker]

Even with the generosity of daily EMH in the 2 Parks, Florida Disney operating hours are less than previous years and current hours in CA (with more Covid restrictions than FL)

Just one of the reasons we have a trip to DLR scheduled with no plans on the horizon for WDW. I don't know why the difference, but everything seems to be superior at DLR vs WDW right- the Halloween Party sounds amazing, the decorations are better, the hours are better and they seem to have their act together vs WDW which only seems to know how to open more restaurants with more limitations on dining, emh's vs parties, cut hours and on and on and on.

And it's not Covid related- Anything WDW does right now is NOT based on safety issues. They lost that excuse once they started packing the parks and allowing people to be packed like sardines at HEA.

 

[luv2cheer92]

Just one of the reasons we have a trip to DLR scheduled with no plans on the horizon for WDW. I don't know why the difference, but everything seems to be superior at DLR vs WDW right- the Halloween Party sounds amazing, the decorations are better, the hours are better and they seem to have their act together vs WDW which only seems to know how to open more restaurants with more limitations on dining, emh's vs parties, cut hours and on and on and on.

And it's not Covid related- Anything WDW does right now is NOT based on safety issues. They lost that excuse once they started packing the parks and allowing people to be packed like sardines at HEA.

I find that interesting considering DLR just cut hours in October while WDW recently expanded October hours.

 

[cakebaker]

I find that interesting considering DLR just cut hours in October while WDW recently expanded October hours.

They don't have the second half of October posted yet and even with an hour cut back, they're still open an hour later than the MK and 1.5 hrs longer on the nights the MK has parties. I would expect them to go back to 11 once they get closer to Halloween, but as I said, still longer hours than the MK as it is. Additionally, their party- which looks much better than BooBash, is 5 hours vs a 3 hr after hours event. That does cause CA to close early, but with only the 2 parks, it's not hard to get everything in over a several day trip.
It's not unusual to cut hours in the fall, but then you have to have fairly decent hours to start with to be able to cut back at all. The MK is pretty much closing as early as it can without it being ridiculous.

I actually don't see where the MK has expanded hours- still looks like a 9pm closing some nights, 8:30 for all the nights when they have an after hours event.

We're really excited about it and hope things stay fairly stable in CA or a miracle happens and the vaccine for kids comes out next month. Otherwise, this trip is on the chopping block as well.

 

[mom2rtk]

Lucky you. Maybe you've gone during low attendance, maybe you got lucky. In multiple trips, I have never ever been able to get more than 1 of those in a day.

You should have asked for some remedial FP help here on the DIS.

 

[havoc315]

You should have asked for some remedial FP help here on the DIS.

No help would change it.
Example— last FP+ trip to Epcot, Pre-pandemic.
Got a 2pm to Soarin for a party of 7
Also got Mission Space and Spaceship Earth.

So 1 good FP. The other 2 attractions had 5 minute lines, didn’t really need the FPs.
After using all 3 FPs, I refreshed the app about 10 times over the next hour. Wasn’t able to get Frozen or Test Track. So after an hour of trying, everyone decided to call it a day.

similarly, went to Animal Kingdom. There were no FOP fps in advance of our day — I booked 61 days in advance. None available. Checked about once a week, never opened up.
On the actual day —
We had FPs for 9, 10, and 11. Our plan was to stay in the park till noon.
we had FPs for safari, Navi and dinosaur. (safari and dinosaur were both walk-ons even if we didn’t have FPs at those moments)
After using the last FP at 11, we refreshed the app 5-10 times during our last hour, FOP never opened up in that hour.

 

[quandrea]

There was a time.
A time in the sepia toned past when Fast Passes did not exist at all.
A time when you got to the parks and stood in a line.
A time when you could spend all day in the park and only ride 4 to 5 rides.
Then the heavens opened and delivered us Fast Pass Kiosks. One member of your party would rush to the FP stations ( cradling the entire party's Key to the Kingdom Park Pass cards) and , hopefully, secured FPs for one ride.
Ah, sweet nostalgia.

Moral of this flashback?
It's got to be better than the old ways, let's wait and see how it all shakes out before we shake our collective fists at Cinderella's Castle and curse the inevitable onward march of progress, shall we?

It isn’t better because they are charging for it. Even in the days of stand by only lines, I never waited for anything. My ticket paid for all my park entertainment. I was done when I walked through the gate. My planning let me get it all done. Now they want more, more, more. Nothing positive can be spun from that.

 

[cjlong88]

It isn’t better because they are charging for it. Even in the days of stand by only lines, I never waited for anything. My ticket paid for all my park entertainment. I was done when I walked through the gate. My planning let me get it all done. Now they want more, more, more. Nothing positive can be spun from that.

But your ticket will continue to pay for your park entertainment. The standby line will be available for 99% of the attractions in WDW.

You don’t have to pay for Genie+ or use it to ride attractions with the exceptions of rides that now have VQ (which you can still try to get for free).

 

[AnnabelleTheTalkingTree]

Actually... it is.

Under FP+, it was almost impossible to get FOP unless you were onsite. With the new system, off-site guests should easily be able to purchase FOP.
So, you can now stay off-site instead of onsite, which will easily save more than $200.

If you were staying onsite either way... airfare, hotel, tickets, food... talking a $5,000 to $10,000 vacation, easily. SO another $200 is "a little more money."

I don't actually think that's true for everyone. LOTS of people spend less on their Disney vacations. My family of 4 stays onsite, deluxe through DVC rental, for 10 nights with 10 days of park hoppers. Even adding in flights, food (including plenty of table service, character meals, at least one dinner show, and a few signature meals and alcohol), and we're usually at right around $8,000. Obviously there are those who will spend more, but there are also PLENTY of people who will spend much less. My point being that while an extra $500ish (which is the $300 it costs for a family of 4 to have Genie+ for 5 days, adding in wiggle room for a couple of LL attractions) amounts to about an extra 7% of MY vacation cost, that same $500 is almost a 20% increase for a family of 4 spending $3000 on their 5 day value resort stay with single park a day tickets.

My point being, "a little bit of money" is a relative thing.

 

[NickC]

I am in the 'wait and see' camp. But, overall, yes, I am a bit apprehensive about changes at WDW. Why? Because the current management is making a lot of poor changes. 8 or 9 years ago, I would be excited about a new system. But, we are living in the era when putting a DJ playing modern music on Main Street seems like a good idea to the people in charge of making changes. So, I think it is quite reasonable to question some of the decisions that are being made. From what I've read, Genie+ seems like it has some positive aspects, and, honestly, I'm optimistic--- but time will tell.

 

[havoc315]

I don't actually think that's true for everyone. LOTS of people spend less on their Disney vacations. My family of 4 stays onsite, deluxe through DVC rental, for 10 nights with 10 days of park hoppers. Even adding in flights, food (including plenty of table service, character meals, at least one dinner show, and a few signature meals and alcohol), and we're usually at right around $8,000. Obviously there are those who will spend more, but there are also PLENTY of people who will spend much less. My point being that while an extra $500ish (which is the $300 it costs for a family of 4 to have Genie+ for 5 days, adding in wiggle room for a couple of LL attractions) amounts to about an extra 7% of MY vacation cost, that same $500 is almost a 20% increase for a family of 4 spending $3000 on their 5 day value resort stay with single park a day tickets.

My point being, "a little bit of money" is a relative thing.

But I think you proved my point -- I said most families who stay onsite are spending $5,000 to $10,000 -- You then said your family is $8,000.... Right in the middle of my estimate.

As to the family that spends "only" $3,000 --- You're missing the point, Genie+ is not a mandatory purchase. Nobody has to buy it. Just like nobody has to buy park hoppers, eat expensive restaurants, etc.
So your budget family example -- They opted not to buy Park hoppers, despite the added convenience of being able to hop between parks. Similarly, they can opt not to purchase Genie+ if it's outside their budget. Or, more likely... they can purchase G+ for 1 or 2 days, when they plan on trying to get the most done. And use intelligent touring plans their remaining days. Including maximizing early morning hours. So their cost of G+ for 2 days would be $120, not $500.

Or, that family can choose to stay off-site -- Spend $2500 instead of $3,000 by staying in a cheaper off-site location, and applying $500 to G+/LL.

Yes, people with lower budgets have few options. But that's not new. Should Disney drop their ticket prices to $1, so that everyone can afford it? Maybe they should price their VIP tours at $5 per hour, so everyone can book a VIP tour?

That's the actual beauty of Disney's current transition: There is more than one way to slay the beast. Depending on your touring style as well as your budget, you have lots of options.
You want to do Disney's top E-ticket most popular attractions?
You can:
1 -- Bite the bullet and get into a standby line
2 -- Purchase a LL pass
2a - Stay in cheaper accommodations, to make up for the difference in price of LL purchases
3 - Stay onsite, and do the attraction during Extended Morning hours rope drop with a short wait
4 - Stay onsite deluxe, if the attraction is Epcot or MK, and do the attraction during evening extended hours with a relatively short wait
5 - Book a VIP tour that includes the attraction

Obviously, the bigger your budget, the more options you have. But there are options for multiple touring styles and budgets.

 

[cakebaker]

No help would change it.
After using all 3 FPs, I refreshed the app about 10 times over the next hour.
After using the last FP at 11, we refreshed the app 5-10 times during our last hour, FOP never opened up in that hour.

It probably would have helped.
I was never a huge fan of the refresh method, we had ways to ride multiple times I preferred much more, but that's not exactly what the refresh method was.
It isn't just refreshing once every 5-10 minutes. It's refreshing over and over again for however long it takes to get what you want to pop up or get tired of trying. all in one session. People cancelled all the time and in order to catch that drop, you had to be trying at the moment it was dropped- doing it every few minutes, just once or twice significantly reduced any chance you'd pick one up. We've done it with success, I just didn't feel the need to much, I got bored much too quickly and didn't want to spend time doing it when we had other ways. But there were times of refreshing just for a minute or two that we lucked out.

It's one reason I hope they don't ration ride availability because we'll be back to the same old thing of spending time on the phone refreshing constantly to see if something pops up.

 

[havoc315]

It probably would have helped.
I was never a huge fan of the refresh method, we had ways to ride multiple times I preferred much more, but that's not exactly what the refresh method was.
It isn't just refreshing once every 5-10 minutes. It's refreshing over and over again for however long it takes to get what you want to pop up or get tired of trying. all in one session. People cancelled all the time and in order to catch that drop, you had to be trying at the moment it was dropped- doing it every few minutes, just once or twice significantly reduced any chance you'd pick one up. We've done it with success, I just didn't feel the need to much, I got bored much too quickly and didn't want to spend time doing it when we had other ways. But there were times of refreshing just for a minute or two that we lucked out.

It's one reason I hope they don't ration ride availability because we'll be back to the same old thing of spending time on the phone refreshing constantly to see if something pops up.

No interest in sitting on my phone for 20 minutes constantly hitting refresh in the hopes that the right timed FP popped up.

I did occasionally see something decent pop up. Like once saw a 7pm FP to Frozen pop up. But this was at 1pm. We had no plans to be in Epcot for the evening.

G+, if works as designed, won’t be a constant refresh model. Your FP return times should typically be within 60-120 minutes, quite predictably. Even shorter during low crowds / less popular attractions. Possibly a bit longer for some popular rides during high crowds.
But you won’t be in a situation where it’s 11am and all the passes are gone for the day for all the good attractions.

 

[bdiddy]

We were in DL maybe a month after they rolled Maxpass out and I actually loved it! BUT it was only $10 pp per day and we got all of our pictures too. (I know that Maxpass has changed since then) And we were only there two days. So I had no issues paying $80 for the 4 of us for 2 days and actually thought it was a great deal for all the pics and for as many FP’s as we were able to get. I think it was just one at a time but the next available times were pretty much right away and as soon as we scanned in at the beginning of the like we were able to grab another one. I felt like we got so much accomplished and were able to just have one after another all day with no issues.

With that said, this new system is similar in many ways but what I don’t like is that $15 pp for a week (which is how long we go to WDW for) is going to be significantly more money, no photos are included and not all of the rides are included like they were with Maxpass. And the additional cost if you want to skip the line for those top tier rides.

Overall I am not happy about these changes but I will give it a chance. I’m a big planner and that’s part of the fun for me but all of this micromanaging and charging extra for every little thing now is even too much for me. I’m leaning towards we are just going to start going in off times and see what the standby lines are like and make decisions based on that.

 

[quandrea]

But your ticket will continue to pay for your park entertainment. The standby line will be available for 99% of the attractions in WDW.

You don’t have to pay for Genie+ or use it to ride attractions with the exceptions of rides that now have VQ (which you can still try to get for free).

I realise that. I have not waited for a ride at Disney in probably 27 years. Being relegated to a standby line is a significant drop in the value of my annual pass. Fast pass allowed me to ride everything I wanted without any extra charges. That is no longer the case. It’s wait in line or pay.

 

[bdiddy]

We were in DL maybe a month after they rolled Maxpass out and I actually loved it! BUT it was only $10 pp per day and we got all of our pictures too. (I know that Maxpass has changed since then) And we were only there two days. So I had no issues paying $80 for the 4 of us for 2 days and actually thought it was a great deal for all the pics and for as many FP’s as we were able to get. I think it was just one at a time but the next available times were pretty much right away and as soon as we scanned in at the beginning of the like we were able to grab another one. I felt like we got so much accomplished and were able to just have one after another all day with no issues.

With that said, this new system is similar in many ways but what I don’t like is that $15 pp for a week (which is how long we go to WDW for) is going to be significantly more money, no photos are included and not all of the rides are included like they were with Maxpass. And then the additional cost if you want to skip the line for those top tier rides.

Overall I am not happy about these changes but I will give it a chance. I’m a big planner and that’s part of the fun for me but all of this micromanaging and charging extra for every little thing now is even too much for me. I’m leaning towards we are just going to start going in off times and see what the standby lines are like and make decisions based on that.

 

[bdiddy]

Oops sorry I have no idea how I did that!

 

[mom2rtk]

We were in DL maybe a month after they rolled Maxpass out and I actually loved it! BUT it was only $10 pp per day and we got all of our pictures too. (I know that Maxpass has changed since then) And we were only there two days. So I had no issues paying $80 for the 4 of us for 2 days and actually thought it was a great deal for all the pics and for as many FP’s as we were able to get. I think it was just one at a time but the next available times were pretty much right away and as soon as we scanned in at the beginning of the like we were able to grab another one. I felt like we got so much accomplished and were able to just have one after another all day with no issues.

With that said, this new system is similar in many ways but what I don’t like is that $15 pp for a week (which is how long we go to WDW for) is going to be significantly more money, no photos are included and not all of the rides are included like they were with Maxpass. And the additional cost if you want to skip the line for those top tier rides.

Overall I am not happy about these changes but I will give it a chance. I’m a big planner and that’s part of the fun for me but all of this micromanaging and charging extra for every little thing now is even too much for me. I’m leaning towards we are just going to start going in off times and see what the standby lines are like and make decisions based on that.

We loved MaxPass as well. But while this has a similar structure, it's not the same.

1) There is no similar free program remaining
2) You lose the highest demand attractions, the ones most appealing to have a system for.
3) WDW tends to be a longer vacation since there are 4 parks instead of 2. That doubles the cost right off the bat.
4) Photopass isn't included for WDW. That takes $169 off the total value right there.

 

[Toolulu22]

But I think you proved my point -- I said most families who stay onsite are spending $5,000 to $10,000 -- You then said your family is $8,000.... Right in the middle of my estimate.

As to the family that spends "only" $3,000 --- You're missing the point, Genie+ is not a mandatory purchase. Nobody has to buy it. Just like nobody has to buy park hoppers, eat expensive restaurants, etc.
So your budget family example -- They opted not to buy Park hoppers, despite the added convenience of being able to hop between parks. Similarly, they can opt not to purchase Genie+ if it's outside their budget. Or, more likely... they can purchase G+ for 1 or 2 days, when they plan on trying to get the most done. And use intelligent touring plans their remaining days. Including maximizing early morning hours. So their cost of G+ for 2 days would be $120, not $500.

Or, that family can choose to stay off-site -- Spend $2500 instead of $3,000 by staying in a cheaper off-site location, and applying $500 to G+/LL.

Yes, people with lower budgets have few options. But that's not new. Should Disney drop their ticket prices to $1, so that everyone can afford it? Maybe they should price their VIP tours at $5 per hour, so everyone can book a VIP tour?

That's the actual beauty of Disney's current transition: There is more than one way to slay the beast. Depending on your touring style as well as your budget, you have lots of options.
You want to do Disney's top E-ticket most popular attractions?
You can:
1 -- Bite the bullet and get into a standby line
2 -- Purchase a LL pass
2a - Stay in cheaper accommodations, to make up for the difference in price of LL purchases
3 - Stay onsite, and do the attraction during Extended Morning hours rope drop with a short wait
4 - Stay onsite deluxe, if the attraction is Epcot or MK, and do the attraction during evening extended hours with a relatively short wait
5 - Book a VIP tour that includes the attraction

Obviously, the bigger your budget, the more options you have. But there are options for multiple touring styles and budgets.

And we’re hoping they bring back the paid After Hours options. We did that last time at AK from 9pm-12pm (with 7pm entry) and would do it again in lieu of a regular park day. We also tacked on the Early Morning Hours for Magic Kingdom and Hollywood Studios and we able to ride to our hearts content, were among the first on Space Mountain and RNR (rode twice) at opening and then had an included breakfast. Yes, more paid options, but we got the rides done with little crowds with a shorter park ticket package because we were able to accomplish all the rides we wanted to do in one day per park. That’s not right for everyone, but we’re good spending time outside the parks.

 

[mom2rtk]

But I think you proved my point -- I said most families who stay onsite are spending $5,000 to $10,000 -- You then said your family is $8,000.... Right in the middle of my estimate.

As to the family that spends "only" $3,000 --- You're missing the point, Genie+ is not a mandatory purchase. Nobody has to buy it. Just like nobody has to buy park hoppers, eat expensive restaurants, etc.
So your budget family example -- They opted not to buy Park hoppers, despite the added convenience of being able to hop between parks. Similarly, they can opt not to purchase Genie+ if it's outside their budget. Or, more likely... they can purchase G+ for 1 or 2 days, when they plan on trying to get the most done. And use intelligent touring plans their remaining days. Including maximizing early morning hours. So their cost of G+ for 2 days would be $120, not $500.

Or, that family can choose to stay off-site -- Spend $2500 instead of $3,000 by staying in a cheaper off-site location, and applying $500 to G+/LL.

Yes, people with lower budgets have few options. But that's not new. Should Disney drop their ticket prices to $1, so that everyone can afford it? Maybe they should price their VIP tours at $5 per hour, so everyone can book a VIP tour?

That's the actual beauty of Disney's current transition: There is more than one way to slay the beast. Depending on your touring style as well as your budget, you have lots of options.
You want to do Disney's top E-ticket most popular attractions?
You can:
1 -- Bite the bullet and get into a standby line
2 -- Purchase a LL pass
2a - Stay in cheaper accommodations, to make up for the difference in price of LL purchases
3 - Stay onsite, and do the attraction during Extended Morning hours rope drop with a short wait
4 - Stay onsite deluxe, if the attraction is Epcot or MK, and do the attraction during evening extended hours with a relatively short wait
5 - Book a VIP tour that includes the attraction

Obviously, the bigger your budget, the more options you have. But there are options for multiple touring styles and budgets.

But you seem oblivious to the fact that what you describe makes for a downgrade in experience for anyone who can't afford those options. Or even for those who can afford the other options, but don't think it's a good value for what it costs.

Of course people can bite the bullet and use standby. But the people who previously used "free" fastpass and are now relegated to this are just never going to agree with you that this is a great system. It's a clear downgrade.

If you're a person who can 1) afford the add on and 2) feel like you're getting value for it, then you're going to love it. Especially if a bunch of those $3K visitors stop going and the top tier FPs are even easier for you to get on demand.

Just be honest and admit there are valid reasons for some not to be excited about this.

We get it. You can afford it. And you are excited about it. You're one of the winners in this. Congratulations. Just let others feel how they feel about it. You don't need to show them the light on why they are going to have a great time standing in "free" standby lines all day.

 

[NavyDad]

I'm shocked at the negative feedback and backlash about the Genie+ announcement. Seems it's pure apprehension about change.
Too many people, I believe, I erroneously viewing this as now having to pay $15 per day for FP+, and having to book every morning at 7am, instead of 60 days in advance.
But this is NOT FP+. It should end up being a superior product. And for most attractions, there should be plenty of availability through the day. You would only be booking at 7am, if you want a 9am return time.

So with recent changes... I'm going to share my optimistic view of touring the parks, as an onsite deluxe guest:

Animal Kingdom Day: -- Assuming FOP and Safari are the "upcharge" attractions:
7-8 - Book Navi River on Genie+, 8-9am return time
7:30: No need to pay an upcharge for FOP, just do it during Early Entry rope drop for no charge.
8:00 -- At regular opening, the standby line at Safari should be bearable without the need to pay any upcharge.
After Safari, backtrack, go do Navi River with Genie+ reservation towards the end of your Genie+ window..
By 9am -- Board Navi River with Genie+, book Expedition Everest, Genie+ return time around 10-11am
After Navi River, start going counter-clockwise -- Go do Dinosaur in Standby around 9:30, standby of 15-20. Play games around Dinoland
Around 10 -- redeem your Genie+ at Expedition Everest, book next Genie+ for River Rapids, around 12pm-1pm
After Expedition Everest -- Do some of the walking tours, see Lion King. eat lunch. See Bug movie if interested..
After lunch, 12-1, redeem Genie+ for River Rapids. As redeeming, book and evening Genie+ for your park hop evening park.

So every major attraction done at AK, without paying the individual attraction fees..... only paying the $15 Genie+, and skipping the need for any significant lines.

DHS -- Assume Slinky and ROTR are "up charge"
7 -- Try to get ROTR with regular free boarding group. If fail, pay the $20 fee for a ride reservation around noon. Pay for evening Slinky
Book Genie+ for Runaway Train, 9am-10am window
8:30 am -- early entry: Straight to TOT. As soon as completed, go right to RNR. Should be getting off RNR no later than 9:15.
From there, around 9:15, so redeem your Runaway Train Genie+. While redeeming, book Smuggler's Run, return time should be somewhere between 11am and 1pm. After Runaway Train --- Go ride Star Tours Standby (still early, line should be under 15 minutes), Muppetvision. Depending on ROTR and Smuggler's Run return times, maybe see BATB or other shows.
Between 11 and 1 (won't take the whole 2 hours) redeem your LL or boarding group for ROTR, use Genie+ for Smuggler's Run. Book another Genie+ for the evening for TSM.

After walking on to both Star Wars rides, go leave for the afternoon. Go to the pool. Take a 4-5 hour break.
Come back in the evening, use the Genie+ reservation for TSM. I could skip Saucers or do them late when the standby line is short. Might even be able to get a 8-9pm Saucers Genie+ reservation after doing TSM. Ride Slinky with the purchased LL.
Hopefully finish the night at Fantasmic.

Every major attraction at DHS accomplished, with time for a long mid-day break, and no significant lines. Used Genie+/LL for Runaway Train, Smuggler's Run, TSM, ROTR, Slinky. Used early entry for TOT and RNR. If I was successful getting a boarding group for ROTR, then didn't even need to purchase a time.

I'll do Epcot and Magic Kingdom later in another post. If I go to those parks on nights with extended hours, they will be super easy.

1. I think someone who describes themselves as an onsite deluxe guest may have a different perspective about how great all of the recent changes are compared to someone who can barely afford to go to WDW or if they stay onsite can't fathom being able to afford the deluxe resorts.

2. There are just some people who like to complain about everything all of the time. This is their place to vent because if they complained to their friends and family, those people may look at them like they are from another planet. Some of the biggest complainers about the transition to FP+ 7-8 years ago spent every waking moment saying how that system was going to be the end of them going to WDW and they were just so mad online, yet they have spent the last 7-8 years still posting about all of their trips to WDW and now are bemoaning the loss of the system they complained about non-stop for years. Some people just need to have something to complain about.