Graduation Decorum Rant

[luvsJack]

That sounds like a unique form of torture. I’ve never been to any event of that kind that was as long. You’d need a meal break, several trips to the bathroom and maybe even a nap to get through it. And it seems insane to bring young children.

We were so blessed when dd was doing dance. They split their recital into two shows. One for a certain age and under and one for a certain age and older. So the younger kids didn't have to sit through such a long performance. Plus she would hire a few college students for the younger kids' recital. We delivered our kids to the dressing room and they stayed there. Their dance teacher would take them out to their performance and for the finale. We picked them up back stage after it was over. No bored little dancers! And they had a ball.

 

[luvsJack]

For many dance parents it's the only performance of the whole year. Sports parents spend a lot more time watching multiple events. Band and choir parents spend more time at some fairly uneven performances as well. Personally I consider graduation ceremonies incredibly tedious, even when I'm there to watch one of my kids graduate.

Dd was in choir. They had 5 different choirs. NEVER were they 4 hours long. Even the concerts they did with other schools were that long. Competition is long but as long as you wait until there is no group on stage, you are free to go in and out. Most people only go in and watch their kid's choirs. Some of the choirs have their favorite other schools and they go in and watch those.

 

[cabanafrau]

Dd was in choir. They had 5 different choirs. NEVER were they 4 hours long. Even the concerts they did with other schools were that long. Competition is long but as long as you wait until there is no group on stage, you are free to go in and out. Most people only go in and watch their kid's choirs. Some of the choirs have their favorite other schools and they go in and watch those.

When mine were in choir there were multiple concerts per year. They weren't four hours long, but multiple events adds up, as do multiple games for sports. For many of the dancers the recital was their only performance of the year.

 

[luvsJack]

When mine were in choir there were multiple concerts per year. They weren't four hours long, but multiple events adds up, as do multiple games for sports. For many of the dancers the recital was their only performance of the year.

Oh, I see what you are saying. Yeah, they are in several throughout the year. Some I would have preferred not to go to lol.

And you are right, for many the recital is the only time family gets to see many of the dancers perform. We will be seeing our dgd this weekend! But that is why I liked the way dd's dance school split it by the ages. Made it half as long. Although, sometimes we would stay for the older girls so dd could watch them. But there was a long break in between the two performances so we would leave and go eat and come back.





Kind of on the same note, I get why some parents or families cheer and get so excited for their kid at 8th grade and high school graduation. Its not that they think their child won't go further or that they didn't expect them to make it. Its that its the only recognition their kid gets. I mean if you have an athlete, he/she gets to hear people cheer for them. Same with a choir kid or a dancer. But that kid who makes all A's and plays chess and is all about academics doesn't get that. Or the kid that doesn't make A's but struggled all year and worked hard to pass but doesn't play a sport or sing or dance. For those kids, hearing Mom and Dad cheer for them at whichever graduation is the only time they get to hear that. I know for my middle kid, we did our hopping and hollering at Awards day. He got a big scholarship and we wanted him to hear how proud we were. Of course there its different in that they call the one kid's name, they walk all the way to the other end of the gym to get the certificate--we had plenty of time to celebrate without interfering with the other kids.

 

[goofy4tink]

For many dance parents it's the only performance of the whole year. Sports parents spend a lot more time watching multiple events. Band and choir parents spend more time at some fairly uneven performances as well. Personally I consider graduation ceremonies incredibly tedious, even when I'm there to watch one of my kids graduate.

When my youngest was dancing, the studio was fairly large. They split the recital up over two days...even then each day was close to three hours. The younger girls only performed at one show, the older girls at both.

For graduations, we don't expect anyone other than immediate family to go...but everyone is invited to the party! Most people are very grateful for that. There is truly nothing more boring or tedious than a graduation. And the whole hooting and hollaring thing? I get it, I really do. But, I always felt badly for the kids that didn't have a family that was yelling! Some kids may have had just their parents there, which makes it a bit uncomfortable to start cheering. Other kids were popular, so they had a ton of people screaming, and then the next kid up, who isn't popular and has only a few people there? Crickets. I just wish families/friends could save their screaming for the end.

 

[Cannot_Wait_4Disney]

My son’s school started something a few years back. They have all the kids file in and then the director says “okay now”, all the kids smile and wave, and then the performance starts. It’s actually really adorable even when it’s the high school kids to see them all smile and wave and it eliminates all the sly side waves.

No way would my director have allowed that. No way. You just didn't do that at a convert. By the way there were no sly side waves either. She had a second pair of eyes in the back of her head.

 

[cabanafrau]

When my youngest was dancing, the studio was fairly large. They split the recital up over two days...even then each day was close to three hours. The younger girls only performed at one show, the older girls at both.

For graduations, we don't expect anyone other than immediate family to go...but everyone is invited to the party! Most people are very grateful for that. There is truly nothing more boring or tedious than a graduation. And the whole hooting and hollaring thing? I get it, I really do. But, I always felt badly for the kids that didn't have a family that was yelling! Some kids may have had just their parents there, which makes it a bit uncomfortable to start cheering. Other kids were popular, so they had a ton of people screaming, and then the next kid up, who isn't popular and has only a few people there? Crickets. I just wish families/friends could save their screaming for the end.

My daughters danced at a fairly large studio in years in which the enrollment was over 800 students for a while. Recitals were Fri, Sat. and Sunday nights with a Saturday matinee. Little ones and some of the lowest level classes danced in one, occasionally two shows. I know some studios do separate shows for the little ones, but that wouldn't have worked for the type of shows this studio put on. Sometimes small classes of tiny tots who did not really move out of their lines in choreo performed in front of a set of curtains while set pieces and drops were being changed out in the back. As the tiny ones were moving off stage there were snippets of transitional music and the curtains opening to move directly into the next segment of the show. If that kind of time hadn't been put into creating a real entertainment piece so the audience was never left waiting for the next number to start it could have been a grueling six-hours of misery.

As dancers move up the chain the spacing of the numbers for the young dancers is frequently quick change time for the older dancers to be ready for their next number. In the years that my oldest was on the competition team she changed for many of her numbers in a cage area just offstage when she had 3 minutes or less to be back on stage for a different number. As a dance mom I really tried to avoid working stints in the cage whenever I could.

Graduations are definitely quite tedious IMO, even when my own children were graduating. So far we've been lucky not to be pressed to go for other family and friends due to seating limitations -- thank goodness!

 

[mummabear]

When mine were dancing recitals were generally 4 to 4-1/2 hours long. Some of the very youngest did leave at intermission, but the director encouraged all who were able to remain for the entire show because all of the dancers deserve an audience. Eventually she started the tradition of an extended finale with everyone coming onstage after the closing production number.

Our is a gorgeous professional production, and there are pros and cons to that. Our costumes are $95 each, where as my daughters friend who dances at a “hobby” studio is $30 etc etc
But I do think these loose sight of things in an effort to be professional that they are a children’s dance studio.
I would rather they split the recital into a junior and senior one so it wouldn’t be so long.

 

[Shanti]

No way would my director have allowed that. No way. You just didn't do that at a convert. By the way there were no sly side waves either. She had a second pair of eyes in the back of her head.

It was good that your director taught the kids to focus on the performance instead of themselves.

 

[marcyleecorgan]

I seem to recall our school administration taking notes as to which student's family members were doing the hollering and whistling and whatnot. Those students then came up to the podium to be handed a "placeholder" diploma, switched around on them right on stage LOL by the school secretary. In fact, anyone with "issues", behavioral or academic, got to pay the rental fee for the robes, got to pay the photographer fees, got to pay for all the other costs, got to walk the stage... but it was all for appearances' sake. You didn't get your diploma until 2 weeks later after the principal returned to the building after HIS vacation!

You can imagine how infuriated all those entitled parents were when they met up with their little snowflakes, only to have their kid hold out a beige blank piece of paper, instead of an actual diploma that they could now use in university applications or internships... turns out that hooting and hollering in public like a gibbon, at a occasion that demands decorum, impacts the ability to get a job or apply for higher education....

 

[MaryLovesPoohBear]

I seem to recall our school administration taking notes as to which student's family members were doing the hollering and whistling and whatnot. Those students then came up to the podium to be handed a "placeholder" diploma, switched around on them right on stage LOL by the school secretary. In fact, anyone with "issues", behavioral or academic, got to pay the rental fee for the robes, got to pay the photographer fees, got to pay for all the other costs, got to walk the stage... but it was all for appearances' sake. You didn't get your diploma until 2 weeks later after the principal returned to the building after HIS vacation!

You can imagine how infuriated all those entitled parents were when they met up with their little snowflakes, only to have their kid hold out a beige blank piece of paper, instead of an actual diploma that they could now use in university applications or internships... turns out that hooting and hollering in public like a gibbon, at a occasion that demands decorum, impacts the ability to get a job or apply for higher education....

So, because Uncle Johnny couldn't keep to his seat, the nephew couldn't start his internship until the principal returned from vacation?

Sorry but that sounds like the principal had a God complex. Sorry, dude, but I would be taking that up with the school board. That saying about something being on your permanent record, that is an old wives tale. The hand of the principal shouldn't reach past the graduation date.

 

[DisneyOma]

Welcome to graduation season!

I've had 3 graduate from public high school since 2012 in classes of 350+. Graduation takes place in the local concert arena and seats 15,000 plus. While I've not witnessed robes open and flowing, or improper decorum among the graduates, I have seen the bad behavior of their "fans" that you refer to. It is ridiculous! I was just re-watching the video today of my child who graduated last year (he gave a speech) I can not tell you how many people walked in front of me filming him as I was seated in my seat.

We've also had 1 graduate from University with his bachelor's and then his Master's degree at the same college in the school's basketball arena and saw similar behavior to the high school graduations and your experience.

Contrast that to my nephew's graduation from high school on Friday night from a Christian school with a class of 19 students in a church. He had 30 family members present for his graduation and the church was full of other family and friends of the other graduates. We all noticed and remarked how much more dignified and enjoyable the graduation was simply because the "crowd" was polite and considerate. (The ceremony itself was much like my other experiences in design and format.) My brother and sister who have younger children joked that they would start sending their kids to private school just for the respectful graduation.

I think if you have any large gathering of this kind it gets out of hand, just like any small group is much more intimate and easier to keep level. We have a small alternative high school in our city - it has 5-6 graduates a year. They have a lot fewer issues at their ceremony each year than we do at the regular high school that graduates 120+ a year.

When my oldest graduated as valedictorian, the ultimate in graduation obnoxiousness occurred. The family of one student hired a small plane to fly over the outdoor graduation ceremony, during the ceremony. It happened to fly over while my daughter was giving her speech. So, she paused as the (very loud) plane flew over. Then continued her speech, only to have the freaking plane return and make a second pass.

 

[SteveH]

...only to have their kid hold out a beige blank piece of paper, instead of an actual diploma

In our area and back when I graduated, nobody got their actual diploma, you had to go back to the school a week later and make sure all your fees were paid up and everything was returned. Until you did they held on to it, but I recall that you only had a couple weeks before the office was closed for a few weeks, some of my sons friends got burned by that.

 

[SteveH]

That saying about something being on your permanent record, that is an old wives tale. The hand of the principal shouldn't reach past the graduation date.

Well it can be on your permanent record with the school, but nobody else is gong to care or know about it, all they care about is your diploma or transcript. Now maybe the military might care.

 

[MaryLovesPoohBear]

Well it can be on your permanent record with the school, but nobody else is gong to care or know about it, all they care about is your diploma or transcript. Now maybe the military might care.

Nope, they don't care either.

 

[Wishing on a star]

This isn't about graduation ceremonies.. but just in general. The whole, Entitlement, everything revolves around me, and I don't care about anyone else mentality.

We just got back from a short trip to a a very nice resort.
The kind that has weddings, corporate events, etc.
I was NOT thinking that we would see so much uncouth behavior! Especially since, basically, school is still in session, and well over a week before Memorial Day.
I was wrong!
There were people at the pool with yelling, shrieking, unsupervised kids until it was time that they shut it down. I am not talking about normal kids 'playing'... but over-tired, overwhelmed, unsupervised kids... sounds like kids being murdered.
People would walk by outside the patios and balconies, until late hours, all self-absorbed, talking and calling out loudly to each other, with no respect for disturbing the peace of everyone else, as the sounds just echoed through the whole complex.
I mentioned this to my husband, and said, "makes me want to just start 'YELLING' out like I am taking to somebody... just yelling, randomly, anything, at the top of my voice..."
We were sitting outdoors at one of the restaurants, where a group of lame, oblivious, parents were ignoring their group of young boys as they ran all around throwing a footballs !

I swear, it was more like lame loser weekend at the old Roadside Inn than a nice getaway at an upscale resort.

Really eye opening how bad things seem to have become.

 

[DisneyOma]

That saying about something being on your permanent record, that is an old wives tale. The hand of the principal shouldn't reach past the graduation date.

We've had colleges that have requested records along with grades - and we've also had the police access the records of past graduates. And I believe what you do follows you in life - it's not the hand of the principal, it's the behavior of the student that gets things on record. Why should all that disappear after some date?

 

[mom2rtk]

This isn't about graduation ceremonies.. but just in general. The whole, Entitlement, everything revolves around me, and I don't care about anyone else mentality.

We just got back from a short trip to a a very nice resort.
The kind that has weddings, corporate events, etc.
I was NOT thinking that we would see so much uncouth behavior! Especially since, basically, school is still in session, and well over a week before Memorial Day.
I was wrong!
There were people at the pool with yelling, shrieking, unsupervised kids until it was time that they shut it down. I am not talking about normal kids 'playing'... but over-tired, overwhelmed, unsupervised kids... sounds like kids being murdered.
People would walk by outside the patios and balconies, until late hours, all self-absorbed, talking and calling out loudly to each other, with no respect for disturbing the peace of everyone else, as the sounds just echoed through the whole complex.
I mentioned this to my husband, and said, "makes me want to just start 'YELLING' out like I am taking to somebody... just yelling, randomly, anything, at the top of my voice..."
We were sitting outdoors at one of the restaurants, where a group of lame, oblivious, parents were ignoring their group of young boys as they ran all around throwing a footballs !

I swear, it was more like lame loser weekend at the old Roadside Inn than a nice getaway at an upscale resort.

Really eye opening how bad things seem to have become.

There have been graduations going on here for weeks. Lots of schools start well before Labor Day and start letting out in mid-May.

 

[MaryLovesPoohBear]

We've had colleges that have requested records along with grades - and we've also had the police access the records of past graduates. And I believe what you do follows you in life - it's not the hand of the principal, it's the behavior of the student that gets things on record. Why should all that disappear after some date?

"Records," as in what? Little Johnnie was a bad boy in the 3rd grade? Yes, that should disappear, right when he walks into 4th grade but certainly by the time he graduates. Same with being a bully. Being a bully in high school does not transfer to being a bully in college, or even in life. Little pond vs big pond. Sure some people never change. But most people do. To say nothing about these kids being minors. Heck even law enforcement seals records of minors.

Do you really believe that someone isn't going to get into college because his grandfather whistled at graduation? Or because Aunt Martha held up a sign? Other than being an (well I can't say it here), what has the principal accomplished by holding the diploma hostage for 2 weeks? Control, that is all. Which makes me wonder about him, not the graduates that have to wait.

 

[Wishing on a star]

Yes, we have already traveled... NO reason to question my comments.
My whole point was that is was not a 'family' vacation time, or an Orlando or Holiday Inn 'family' vacation week, or resort.
In fact, we left the very day after an EARLY graduation that we went to.
But, graduations are often held days before the actual end of the school years.
We passed many school zones, still in session, as we traveled.
Many graduations had not been completed.
and, this was well over a week before the Memorial Week time when family vacations often begin.

About holding the diplomas... Hey, it is okay to have students to pick up their diploma's later.
I have no problem with that.
There could be issues with the kids grades, records, or behavior.

What I do have a huge problem with is the two week delay, and the observation of OTHERS (family or friends) behaviors.
That is just not okay.