What is going on with Disney parks?

[DGsAtBLT]

I am NOT going to sacrifice going to a place I love to prove a point to somebody who isn’t even listening or won’t even notice. The only thing that happens if we don’t go is we miss out on Disney.

We will adjust our habits, we will go less, eventually we may be priced out entirely, but as long as it’s still an enjoyable place for us we’re going to keep going and not go somewhere else to stick it to a company that won’t even notice.

 

[LSUmiss]

Nostalgia fades with each new generation and even what I am nostalgic for at Disney is slowly disappearing.

Also, younger generations may now have nostalgia for Universal/Harry Potter and not Disney.

Of course Disney will always have people, but maybe not in the same capacity they are enjoying right now.

Exactly. We go now & keeping trying new strategies b/c we want DS to experience what we did. But with each failed attempt, we are more & more defeated. If this next trip doesn’t work, we will be done for awhile. So then DS ends up not growing up with that same nostalgia. I know a bunch of other families that have also reached their thresholds so it might take 20 years, but this business strategy will eventually come back to bite them imo.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Exactly. We go now & keeping trying new strategies b/c we want DS to experience what we did. But with each failed attempt, we are more & more defeated. If this next trip doesn’t work, we will be done for awhile. So then DS ends up not growing up with that same nostalgia. I know a bunch of other families that have also reached their thresholds so it might take 20 years, but this business strategy will eventually come back to bite them imo.

Keep in mind memories may not be there anyways. And sometimes you're putting the pressure on yourself to have that amazing time but your child may not even 'care' so to speak.

I have little memories from my previous trips as a kid. Some things here and there of course but strong memories are when I was older. I have much much stronger memories of going to the Lake visiting my grandparents as a kid than I do going to WDW and Universal.

Nostalgia isn't defined as an age thing. Lot of people here on the Boards with strong nostalgic ties are of an age where they went when they were a bit older they just remember what it was like decades ago and yearn for that time period. Your child may not remember a particular ride but they may remember having fun (in general) at WDW thus getting a nostalgic emotion attached to it. But you really don't necessarily know that. Nostalgia is simply looking fondly on the past that gave you happy memories but you can't control just what memories and emotions create that nostalgia.

 

[rteetz]

Keep in mind memories may not be there anyways. And sometimes you're putting the pressure on yourself to have that amazing time but your child may not even 'care' so to speak.

I have little memories from my previous trips as a kid. Some things here and there of course but strong memories are when I was older. I have much much stronger memories of going to the Lake visiting my grandparents as a kid than I do going to WDW and Universal.

Nostalgia isn't defined as an age thing. Lot of people here on the Boards with strong nostalgic ties are of an age where they went when they were a bit older they just remember what it was like decades ago and yearn for that time period. Your child may not remember a particular ride but they may remember having fun (in general) at WDW thus getting a nostalgic emotion attached to it. But you really don't necessarily know that. Nostalgia is simply looking fondly on the past that gave you happy memories but you can't control just what memories and emotions create that nostalgia.

And see now I am younger than many people here but I have strong memories of early trips to WDW. For example my first tooth was lost at WDW. I also got lost that same trip lol. Usually the memories are attached to bigger events not the attractions necessarily. I surely don’t remember every single ride I did or what I ate on every trip but the larger moments I do.

 

[SaintsManiac]

And see now I am younger than many people here but I have strong memories of early trips to WDW. For example my first tooth was lost at WDW. I also got lost that same trip lol. Usually the memories are attached to bigger events not the attractions necessarily. I surely don’t remember every single ride I did or what I ate on every trip but the larger moments I do.

My kid lost a tooth on Adventureland bridge and that is one of our best WDW stories!

 

[rteetz]

My kid lost a tooth on Adventureland bridge and that is one of our best WDW stories!

Mine wasn’t that special . I lost mine in our room at Pop Century. Tooth fairy left me disney dollars

 

[SaintsManiac]

Mine wasn’t that special . I lost mine in our room at Pop Century. Tooth fairy left me disney dollars

There was also one lost in a Lard Lad donut in our room at Cabana Bay.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

And see now I am younger than many people here but I have strong memories of early trips to WDW. For example my first tooth was lost at WDW. I also got lost that same trip lol. Usually the memories are attached to bigger events not the attractions necessarily. I surely don’t remember every single ride I did or what I ate on every trip but the larger moments I do.

You went quite often correct (can't remember)? You love love love Disney theme parks correct?

Lots of kids are more or less so so about it all. Oh they may love Disney but they may not be so over the moon in love with a theme park or it's the same amount of enjoyment as something else they've done.

Seen many posts about how their kids were just as excited for pool time at the resort as they were for MK time.

I have memories but they aren't really strong connections. In order to have a strong memory over decades and decades you have to connect it within your brain. Otherwise it may just be an over reaching feeling rather than specific memories. Other vacations won out on the memory front. Not directed at the PP but I get the feeling that some posters would be disappointed in that or upset (how many posts are out there about the parents upset their kids don't want to go to Disney again and go somewhere else) and they would blame Disney but is it really Disney's fault that I can recall having more fun at the Lake on a pontoon boat and playing farkle at night than I did being at MK at various ages (and that's not saying I didn't have fun at WDW though)? Nah.

I was more or less trying to say you really can't blame Disney if your child doesn't have the nostaglic feeling you do especially because you cannot control what gives you that emotion. You can't recreate everything from when you were younger because they are your nostalgic feelings and you open yourself up to the increased chance of disappointment (but aiming at the wrong party IMO) when you try to force it.

The PP has a less than 2 year old. I don't remember a darn thing about my SeaWorld, Busch Gardens, Universal, DLR and WDW trips from when I was a few years old. There's a couple of photos to prove it but other than that it's my parents that have the memories not me from those young young years. If there's any nostaglic feelings created from when I was quite young it's my parent's feelings not mine irrespective of park experience. So when you're talking about being upset or sad that your child may not grow up with the same nostaglic emotions you had you have to keep that in perspective--they may not have had those feelings in the first place.

 

[Q-man]

They are not hurting them now. When the next economic downturn hits, they are going to get hit harder than they have ever been hit before. Plus, the ill will that has built up amongst loyal customers will make it harder for them to recover.

Actually, I think with locking so many into DVC it keeps them from being hit as hard as in the past. Disney is closing in on 25% of on property rooms being DVC. Plus Disney knows how to use free dining as a tool in a bad economy.

 

[Remy is Up]

Exactly. We go now & keeping trying new strategies b/c we want DS to experience what we did. But with each failed attempt, we are more & more defeated. If this next trip doesn’t work, we will be done for awhile. So then DS ends up not growing up with that same nostalgia. I know a bunch of other families that have also reached their thresholds so it might take 20 years, but this business strategy will eventually come back to bite them imo.

This is a company with an army of economic analysts who can change direction on a dime and generally in front of the direction the economy is headed. They will see the signs and be prepared for any downturn and already have a plan in place to insulate them through it. This is one of the most successful companies in the world and while no company is completely recession proof, they are one of the closest companies to it because they will adjust to any economic swings. And the reality is people who are currently jaded, a large percentage will return at some point because Disney and WDW are a significant part of their past.

 

[Q-man]

I'm not buying into the whole "Thinning The Herd" theory. It's hard to believe the board of directors sit around trying to figure out how to keep some people from coming to the parks so the people that do still go dont have to wait in long lines. Yea, they make a ton of money off their intial ticket sales but they also make a massive amount of money on sales throughout the parks, hard to believe Disney is raising prices in Hope's less people will show up and that the price increases will compensate for lack of attendance cause their not just losing tickets sales, they would be losing thousands per family besides ticket sales. If anything, they are sitting around trying to figure out how to get more people in the parks with unique ways to control the crowd like FP and VQ. It takes a massive amount of money to build new attractions and those new attractions come with a daily operating cost. The price increases are to cover all the added expenses that Disney has incurred from upgrading and expanding their parks. IMO

Read up on Las Vegas and what they call 'whales' and then see how large a percentage of money is made off such a small percentage of patrons. Disney looks to be applying those principles.

 

[Mome Rath]

We are a four generation Disney family... it definitely did and does hold nostalgia for each generation. Obviously that didn't happen the same for all of us; it couldn't because we didn't start going til I was around 9, and my grandmother was in her 50's, early 60's. I do think it called up nostalgia for her. For the rest of us, it became nostalgic in and of itself. Now we have younglings in the family that have been their whole lives and they want to go as many times as someone will take them, and, yes, I think as they get older they will want to go back. If they will over time depends on a lot of factors.

We were, and sometimes still are, a "budget" traveling family. We used to stay off site until they built other hotels in our price range on site. We still stay value on many trips. We don't do a lot of extras, we fly as cheap as we can, etc... I've mentioned before, we have also pushed "pause" when we didn't like how Disney was handling certain things. When they were corrected, we started going again. The internet has just made it so much more vocal as to the "why's" of people's choices.

My opinion over time is that Disney is responsive to economics, to politics, to war, to guest satisfaction, etc... currently. Meaning I still feel they are a well-run business. That may change.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

We are a four generation Disney family... it definitely did and does hold nostalgia for each generation. Obviously that didn't happen the same for all of us; it couldn't because we didn't start going til I was around 9, and my grandmother was in her 50's, early 60's. I do think it called up nostalgia for her. For the rest of us, it became nostalgic in and of itself. Now we have younglings in the family that have been their whole lives and they want to go as many times as someone will take them, and, yes, I think as they get older they will want to go back. If they will over time depends on a lot of factors.

We were, and sometimes still are, a "budget" traveling family. We used to stay off site until they built other hotels in our price range on site. We still stay value on many trips. We don't do a lot of extras, we fly as cheap as we can, etc... I've mentioned before, we have also pushed "pause" when we didn't like how Disney was handling certain things. When they were corrected, we started going again. The internet has just made it so much more vocal as to the "why's" of people's choices.

My opinion over time is that Disney is responsive to economics, to politics, to war, to guest satisfaction, etc... currently. Meaning I still feel they are a well-run business. That may change.

I was more specifically talking about feelings of disappointed related to fears that nostgalia may not be there for someone's child. That's not Disney's fault if that doesn't happen. The nostaglic emotions are that of the parent at this point not of the kid anyways. Certainly kids can get nostaglic feelings and be part of that generational Disney family.

I agree on the internet part. There's so many blogs aimed at giving tips and tricks many focused on the 'budget' key word.

 

[mvk]

Anecdotal 10 Year Personal Evidence-
2011-All Star Resort, Free Dining, 5 Day Park Hoppers, Photpass Deluxe, Round Trip Flights, mid August (Value Season), 2 adults, 2 kids under 10, ~$4,000

2020-All Star Resort, Disney Dining Plan, 8 Day Park Hoppers, Memory Maker, Round Trip Flights, Christmas/New Years, 2 adults, 2 kids above 10, ~$8,400

I will be using points for the flights, so they won’t technically cost anything, but wanted to compare with the cost included to keep it relatively the same.

That price might jump out a bit, but that trip in 2011 was about 9.5% of our income. This year, it’s slightly less than 7% of our income. Moved into new house in that time, monthly mortgage is same exact percentage of income, monthly car payments are less of a percent now than they were then. Outside of groceries and gas, everything else is in line percentage-wise of what we were spending 10 years ago.

In that timeframe, WDW added New Fantasyland, Pandora, Toy Story Land, Galaxy’s Edge, Frozen in Epcot, the new Ratatouille ride in Epcot, Mickey’s Runaway Railway in HS, Rivers of Light, many new dining options across the board, completely re-did Disney Springs as an ancillary benefit, refurbished the resorts, added Magic Bands/FP+ (for better or worse, but we like it), put up the Skyliner, and more. Parades, shows, entertainment, etc have come/gone/been replaced but hasn’t noticeably declined in our view.

I don’t think the pricing is much of an issue to us but realize not everyone is the same. We’ve gone just about every year these past 10 years and there wasn’t a time when we thought the value wasn’t there for us. As a contrast, we have stopped going to our local park (Kennywood) completely due to the staffing and cleanliness (or lack thereof) of the park. The rising prices there just aren’t worth the level of aggravation when there.

 

[Farro]

Just as an aside, we can write how we budget, justify our trips until the cows come home, but nothing, nothing will justify how much they charge for hotels.

Polynesian Village (yes I know it's rack rate but discounts just aren't that great anymore) - $663 a night for standard. And that's cheap!

I will complain all I want about hotel rates sky-rocketing yet the service and overall upkeep of hotels aren't keeping in tune with the price.

And to deal with it I found Gran Destino, but otherwise we will just go less and go on other trips. That's fine.

 

[Moliphino]

Just as an aside, we can write how we budget, justify our trips until the cows come home, but nothing, nothing will justify how much they charge for hotels.

Polynesian Village (yes I know it's rack rate but discounts just aren't that great anymore) - $663 a night for standard. And that's cheap!

I will complain all I want about hotel rates sky-rocketing yet the service and overall upkeep of hotels aren't keeping in tune with the price.

And to deal with it I found Gran Destino, but otherwise we will just go less and go on other trips. That's fine.

They can justify the costs because people are paying it. I would never pay $600+ for a hotel room, but clearly plenty of people do because the resorts keep booking up near capacity.

 

[LSUmiss]

Keep in mind memories may not be there anyways. And sometimes you're putting the pressure on yourself to have that amazing time but your child may not even 'care' so to speak.

I have little memories from my previous trips as a kid. Some things here and there of course but strong memories are when I was older. I have much much stronger memories of going to the Lake visiting my grandparents as a kid than I do going to WDW and Universal.

Nostalgia isn't defined as an age thing. Lot of people here on the Boards with strong nostalgic ties are of an age where they went when they were a bit older they just remember what it was like decades ago and yearn for that time period. Your child may not remember a particular ride but they may remember having fun (in general) at WDW thus getting a nostalgic emotion attached to it. But you really don't necessarily know that. Nostalgia is simply looking fondly on the past that gave you happy memories but you can't control just what memories and emotions create that nostalgia.

True except if by the time DS is old enough wdw had become a place that’s known for being a pita with crowds, lines, high prices, etc, he may have no desire to even try it. What makes a lot of ppl go back despite the changes that make it not as enjoyable is the nostalgia.

 

[Farro]

They can justify the costs because people are paying it. I would never pay $600+ for a hotel room, but clearly plenty of people do because the resorts keep booking up near capacity.

I'm pretty sure you know what i meant. But I'll explain.

Yes people are paying it.

Nowhere else would anyone get away with charging those prices. The hotels and amenities just don't cut it.

So if their only justification of the cost is "people will pay it" - not that the hotel itself is worth it, the restaurants, the staff, the amenities, the extras - then that's pretty sad, I will complain about it, and stay elsewhere.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Anecdotal 10 Year Personal Evidence-
2011-All Star Resort, Free Dining, 5 Day Park Hoppers, Photpass Deluxe, Round Trip Flights, mid August (Value Season), 2 adults, 2 kids under 10, ~$4,000

2020-All Star Resort, Disney Dining Plan, 8 Day Park Hoppers, Memory Maker, Round Trip Flights, Christmas/New Years, 2 adults, 2 kids above 10, ~$8,400

I will be using points for the flights, so they won’t technically cost anything, but wanted to compare with the cost included to keep it relatively the same.

That price might jump out a bit, but that trip in 2011 was about 9.5% of our income. This year, it’s slightly less than 7% of our income. Moved into new house in that time, monthly mortgage is same exact percentage of income, monthly car payments are less of a percent now than they were then. Outside of groceries and gas, everything else is in line percentage-wise of what we were spending 10 years ago.

In that timeframe, WDW added New Fantasyland, Pandora, Toy Story Land, Galaxy’s Edge, Frozen in Epcot, the new Ratatouille ride in Epcot, Mickey’s Runaway Railway in HS, Rivers of Light, many new dining options across the board, completely re-did Disney Springs as an ancillary benefit, refurbished the resorts, added Magic Bands/FP+ (for better or worse, but we like it), put up the Skyliner, and more. Parades, shows, entertainment, etc have come/gone/been replaced but hasn’t noticeably declined in our view.

I don’t think the pricing is much of an issue to us but realize not everyone is the same. We’ve gone just about every year these past 10 years and there wasn’t a time when we thought the value wasn’t there for us. As a contrast, we have stopped going to our local park (Kennywood) completely due to the staffing and cleanliness (or lack thereof) of the park. The rising prices there just aren’t worth the level of aggravation when there.

Not that you still wouldn't be able to see a significant increase in costs but you weren't comparing apples to apples. Your trips aren't the same. But that doesn't mean we can't see how the costs have gone up just generally speaking.

 

[SaintsManiac]

I'm pretty sure you know what i meant. But I'll explain.

Yes people are paying it.

Nowhere else would anyone get away with charging those prices. The hotels and amenities just don't cut it.

So if their only justification of the cost is "people will pay it" - not that the hotel itself is worth it, the restaurants, the staff, the amenities, the extras - then that's pretty sad, I will complain about it, and stay elsewhere.

PREACH.