Josh Duggar's Trial Begins Today... GUILTY ON ALL COUNTS!

[TipsyTraveler]

No I'm saying the video Josh watched of the several month old that baby is the youngest victim. That while that baby wasn't physically assaulted by Josh they are the youngest victim here. Sorry for the confusion.

Ah, gotcha. I misunderstood.

 

[pigletto]

I agree with your points but would argue the youngest victim here that is known (to my knowledge) is contained within that story a poster posted. They may have not been physically assaulted by Josh but they were victimized none the less and for others to view including Josh.

I read an article in the Sun from today that says Bobye Holts testimony included the details of when she and her husband came to the house and they were told face to face by Josh and his parents that he had physically molested several girls including a five year old. He was a teen at the time. It’s in her testimony today . I should have linked that to make my post more clear. They said Josh was then sent somewhere for troubled youth.

And that is what made me so mad , they all knew without a doubt from his own mouth what he was capable of. That’s not a boy getting curious. It’s a 15 year old and a 5 year old .

 

[robinb]

I read an article in the Sun from today that says Bobye Holts testimony included the details of when she and her husband came to the house and they were told face to face by Josh and his parents that he had physically molested several girls including a five year old. He was a teen at the time. It’s in her testimony today . I should have linked that to make my post more clear. They said Josh was then sent somewhere for troubled youth.

And that is what made me so mad , they all knew without a doubt from his own mouth what he was capable of. That’s not a boy getting curious. It’s a 15 year old and a 5 year old .

What he did to the 5-year old is much worse than I expected .

 

[dez1978]

I, personally, wouldn’t be able to be a jurist on this trial. The content would be too disturbing for me. I applaud every one of those jury members. This is such important work.

Do you really get a choice tho? I don't recall ever being asked if I could handle being on a jury. I feel like if you get past certain questions and get choosen, thats it. You don't get to say I don't want to hear this. Nor do you really know much about the trial during the selection process. If this was not a celebrity, you wouldn't know much about it heading into selection.

He's running again?
I suspect he is concerned about money. He's still supporting about 10 young kids, he's probably going to be supporting Josh's family when he goes to jail, and he seems to be subsidizing some of his more compliant adult children (for example, doesn't Ben, who has four kids, work as a part-time handyman?). That requires a great deal of money ... and even if he is elected, it's not going to pay what the show paid.
Neither did Anna! Sorry, had to be said.
She probably "wasn't allowed" to attend.
And, in all seriousness, doesn't she have a newborn? That'd make it hard for her to attend.
Agree ... but the parents put the kids in a tough position: Most kids are in school and out in the community when those hormones kick in. Most 14-year old boys get a chance to see girls in socially-appropriate situations: they are allowed to take a girl to a school dance, to hold hands in the hallway at school, to share a kiss in the dark at the movies. Through those innocent, socially-appropriate 14-year old experiences, most boys are able to vent those hormones.
By completely shutting down all age-appropriate social interaction with the opposite sex, these parents put Josh's hormones into a pressure cooker. Of course, he's the one who made the bad choices, but his parents set up a poor environment for teens to get to know one another /to learn about the opposite sex. They contributed to his bad choices.

I have said this myself. Those kids were sheltered and locked away. He would never have been able to ask questions about anything sexual, nor would his parents have talked about it. And he certainly wasn't able to experiment the way other 14-15 year olds are. It doesn't make it ok by any means. But I hold his parents 100% responsible for what happened when he was a kid. They created this, and they enabled him to continue once it was brought to light by sending him to some excuse for "treatment". They could have gotten him real help and he might have had a chance to grow into a decent human. Because most of the rest of the kids seem to be decent. A bit nuts, but decent. It makes me very happy to see that Jill and Jinger have broken away and are doing their own thing.
I actually feel really horrible for Anna. She's had it drilled into her head since birth that she should be subservient to her man. She probably honestly believes if she'd have done more, "put out" more, been a better wife, he'd have never done any of this. And now her job is to stand by him and support him. And I'd bet none of her family is coming out trying to help her or encourage her to leave.

 

[lifesavacation]

Do you really get a choice tho? I don't recall ever being asked if I could handle being on a jury. I feel like if you get past certain questions and get choosen, thats it. You don't get to say I don't want to hear this. Nor do you really know much about the trial during the selection process. If this was not a celebrity, you wouldn't know much about it heading into selection.


I have said this myself. Those kids were sheltered and locked away. He would never have been able to ask questions about anything sexual, nor would his parents have talked about it. And he certainly wasn't able to experiment the way other 14-15 year olds are. It doesn't make it ok by any means. But I hold his parents 100% responsible for what happened when he was a kid. They created this, and they enabled him to continue once it was brought to light by sending him to some excuse for "treatment". They could have gotten him real help and he might have had a chance to grow into a decent human. Because most of the rest of the kids seem to be decent. A bit nuts, but decent. It makes me very happy to see that Jill and Jinger have broken away and are doing their own thing.
I actually feel really horrible for Anna. She's had it drilled into her head since birth that she should be subservient to her man. She probably honestly believes if she'd have done more, "put out" more, been a better wife, he'd have never done any of this. And now her job is to stand by him and support him. And I'd bet none of her family is coming out trying to help her or encourage her to leave.

The content is way too disturbing for me. I would have to leave the courtroom. You just can't unhear or unsee things and I wouldn't want that forever in my memory. But I'm not sure of the answer to your question. Surely they would poll people to ask if they are capable of hearing & seeing the sensitive content.

I really do believe Josh is a predator and he'll continue to victimize. I worry for his children and any children he comes into contact with. I hope he's put in prison.

 

[dez1978]

The content is way too disturbing for me. I would have to leave the courtroom. You just can't unhear or unsee things and I wouldn't want that forever in my memory. But I'm not sure of the answer to your question. Surely they would poll people to ask if they are capable of hearing & seeing the sensitive content.

I really do believe Josh is a predator and he'll continue to victimize. I worry for his children and any children he comes into contact with. I hope he's put in prison.

You don't get to do that tho unless you want to face contempt charges. You can't just leave a courtroom from the jury box lol.

Now during jury selection, you could probably just say you couldn't be unbiased or that you are a victim of abuse yourself and be excused. But I doubt one of the questions is can you handle hearing/seeing sensitive material. I cannot say that for sure as I've never sat on a jury for that, but it seems like they couldn't say that prior to the jury selection.

 

[RedAngie]

Jim Bob and Michelle... they knew. All of the Jane Does (minus 1) are their girls.

But, but….he was only”curious about girls.” No foul, no harm.

I’m surprised they don’t blame their daughters for “tempting” him. Isn’t that usual scenario with those types?

 

[TipsyTraveler]

You don't get to do that tho unless you want to face contempt charges. You can't just leave a courtroom from the jury box lol.

Now during jury selection, you could probably just say you couldn't be unbiased or that you are a victim of abuse yourself and be excused. But I doubt one of the questions is can you handle hearing/seeing sensitive material.

During jury selection, after telling potential jurors that the case would involve hearing/seeing CSAM, they did actually ask something along the lines of “will you be disturbed by this?” Surprisingly, no one raised their hand.

 

[TipsyTraveler]

But, but….he was only”curious about girls.” No foul, no harm.

I’m surprised they don’t blame their daughters for “tempting” him. Isn’t that usual scenario with those types?

They do. IBLP handbooks teach victims to ask themselves what role they played in causing it to happen. Of course, if your organization routinely distributes materials to answer all your questions about how to handle sexual abuse within your family, maybe you should rethink some things.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I read an article in the Sun from today that says Bobye Holts testimony included the details of when she and her husband came to the house and they were told face to face by Josh and his parents that he had physically molested several girls including a five year old. He was a teen at the time. It’s in her testimony today . I should have linked that to make my post more clear. They said Josh was then sent somewhere for troubled youth.

And that is what made me so mad , they all knew without a doubt from his own mouth what he was capable of. That’s not a boy getting curious. It’s a 15 year old and a 5 year old .

I agree it does make us all mad and it's like incomprehensible how this all was able to happen and the curious excuse ugh sickening. I just was trying to say victims of sexual exploitation also include those in images and videos (ones downloaded, awaiting viewership on someone's computer, etc) but didn't mean to make your post any less of a discussion on the extremeness of this case with Josh and just what happened. It's so hard to wrap my mind around this whole family, it's days like these I wish I had never watched their show ever (even briefly in the earlier days) because it's hard to look back on that and know now what we know

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

I really do believe Josh is a predator and he'll continue to victimize.

I have this feeling too. This is a person who shouldn't have contact with children just shouldn't IMO.

 

[pigletto]

I agree it does make us all mad and it's like incomprehensible how this all was able to happen and the curious excuse ugh sickening. I just was trying to say victims of sexual exploitation also include those in images and videos (ones downloaded, awaiting viewership on someone's computer, etc) but didn't mean to make your post any less of a discussion on the extremeness of this case with Josh and just what happened. It's so hard to wrap my mind around this whole family, it's days like these I wish I had never watched their show ever (even briefly in the earlier days) because it's hard to look back on that and know now what we know

I agree with you and I didn’t take any offence. I thought I just hadn’t been clear in my original post.

 

[pigletto]

I have this feeling too. This is a person who shouldn't have contact with children just shouldn't IMO.

It makes me sick to think how vulnerable his children are.

 

[NotUrsula]

I don't care how sheltered you are, no mentally healthy adolescent naturally gets sexually curious about 5 year olds. It should be pretty obvious even to an idiot that a small child and a sexually mature girl are not the same physically. The "sheltered and curious" argument might have held some water if he was accused of peeping at his essentially same-age siblings, but not the little ones. Besides that, scriptural lessons would have made it very clear by that point that such behavior was totally beyond the pale.* Josh knew it was more than just typical adolescent lust, and JB knew it, too; but he was embarrassed at the loss of his vaunted control over everyone in the family. These days what I think JB is most angry about is that Josh's carelessness blew up a situation that JB had come to believe had been successfully buried for good.

(*Edited because my original wording probably was too religion-specific.)

 

[lifesavacation]

Blows me away that in the midst of all this, JB decides to run for the Senate.

 

[NotUrsula]

Blows me away that in the midst of all this, JB decides to run for the Senate.

Doesn't really surprise me; he's all about controlling the narrative, and the Senate run is planned as a distraction. (You know the old saw, "If you don't like the answers, change the conversation.") He'll probably also spin any negative criticisms of himself as the fictitious work of political enemies, and that's an oxymoron unless he's running for some kind of office.

 

[emer95]

The content is way too disturbing for me. I would have to leave the courtroom. You just can't unhear or unsee things and I wouldn't want that forever in my memory. But I'm not sure of the answer to your question. Surely they would poll people to ask if they are capable of hearing & seeing the sensitive content.

I really do believe Josh is a predator and he'll continue to victimize. I worry for his children and any children he comes into contact with. I hope he's put in prison.

I completely agree with you. I’m interested in the case, but to protect myself I’m staying away from news sources that give details. I heard one detail that was so disturbing, it affected me for the entire day and I have to keep putting it out of my mind. It’s mind-boggling to realize that there is such evil out there. And that these little ones are not being protected. My God. This case is heinous.

 

[lifesavacation]

Doesn't really surprise me; he's all about controlling the narrative, and the Senate run is planned as a distraction. (You know the old saw, "If you don't like the answers, change the conversation.") He'll probably also spin any negative criticisms of himself as the fictitious work of political enemies, and that's an oxymoron unless he's running for some kind of office.

He’s not even fit for reality TV, which is really saying something.

 

[happily single]

The prosecution rests. Onto the defense!

What? Where Jill and Jed called by the prosecution?

 

[NotUrsula]

He’s not even fit for reality TV, which is really saying something.

Oh, I think there would still be an opening for the family in some kind of show about what happens to former inspirational TV stars when they turn out to have feet of clay. What JB won't get is *favorable* exposure, and that's the only kind he is interested in. JB doesn't subscribe to the celebrity adage that any news exposure is better than none, because he isn't in it for the fame, but for money & power, and that doesn't grow out of reality shows where you are portrayed as having fallen from a pedestal.

(Reworded.)